fartyandbloated
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https://www.businessinsider.com/ruth-gottesman-donates-1-billion-medical-school-free-tuition-forever-2024-2
Feb 28, 2024 4:02 PM
fartyandbloated
102393
2433
28
https://www.businessinsider.com/ruth-gottesman-donates-1-billion-medical-school-free-tuition-forever-2024-2
Trustrup
As good as this seems, what will happen over time is the highest graded students, ie. the ones with the most ressources will take all the seats over time, making it so richer students get better, cheaper education, while the poor have to pay for worse education. Unless AECOM have some holistic intake system to account for it.
geotard
Of course no ones ever happy.... I'll have to compete with other students to get in now says disgruntled child of wealthy elite.
JustADudeWhoLikesSpace
I did the math based on the interviews and reports. Since each year's tuition is about $50,000, and let's assume it's only for 4 years (I assume it's actually more), that means only about 5,000 people can get free tuition. It's a very generous contribution, but it won't last forever*.
cloverleafbane
She paid to turn the orphan crushing machine off for awhile. Now we need to find a way to destroy it entirely.
Saxytimes
I teach music lessons and I find myself not wanting to recommend US colleges, especially music schools. Hardly any musician makes enough money to go into debt half a million dollars, or even a quarter like me. I did make stupid mistakes too, like stay in school too long. I could have cut off three years but I wanted to stay. I loved being there and not working. Many ragerts
RevolutionOnHerLips
That college of medicine? Albert Einstein.
CrumpetsWithHoneyAreCrumpetsWithBeeVomit
Unexpectedly because her husband was a lifelong INVESTMENT BANKER! It wasn't unexpected.
cntrfldr
Ruth Gottesman, thank you. This selfless act will pay immeasurable dividends over decades.
ColLeslieHapHapablap
Here's a video of the students being told their tuition is now free. https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/s/2BK2rMHCHR
kaarbaakimgr
Medical schools are big business: https://forward.com/news/333786/yeshiva-u-cedes-control-of-half-its-endowment-to-shed-its-einstein-liabilit/?amp=1
happywalker
Zeplin
News so old even Internet Explorer is ahead of you guys.
astronomypictures
Bronx med colleges: New One time administration fee of 1 billion this semester
chichiFregiLover
it's been ages since people like Buffet, or Gates were donating huge amount of money to the ones in need. the problem is that bashing is much easier, than doing a little bit of research
smashpro1
Coincidentally (or not), this woman's husband was good friends with Buffett.
AyZeeeeeeee
You mean she implemented Europe for Bronx med students?
Sw1ftTurtle
Med students should be so in demand they are paid to be educated not the other way around.
Wuz314159
People can afford healthcare in America?
Sw1ftTurtle
Yes, hospitals in the US are not empty.
infrazab
Women with billions vs men with billions
fractalsphere
Imagine being this lady's husband and not telling her about a BILLION DOLLAR portfolio.
strawberrycocoa
Probably kept it secret in case of divorce.
hanniballectern
Imagine having stock worth a billion dollars in a single company, and not having other resources that let you live very comfortably without touching the billion dollar stock. You'll have to imagine it, because it's very uncommon in the real world unless you're a founder of the company. Besides the BH stock her husband ran an investment fund, and the family has donated many millions of dollars in the past.
artie500
In the '70s, her husband was the third member of the triumvirate of Warren Buffet, Charle Munger, and Sandy Gottesman.
TheGoodGirth
Imagine being this lady and having her entire identity reduced to "widow"
smashpro1
Right. The article states that she teaches at the school that is receiving the money, as well as currently serving as the school's chairwoman, and has a history of philanthropy that dates back to the 60s.
AranaDiscoteca
Half of the people posting here have been posting about her as if she did the orphan crushing herself as a billionaire. People barely read the few words there are. Trying to have her whole identity...?
Jorgesomedaymark2
You say "finally," yet I see comments (on Reddit, at least) that say things like "Yeah, but they're rich in the first place" or "Just watch how the money will be mismanaged."
I'm all for uplifting news, but I also feel as though humanity doesn't deserve uplifting news. It's sad.
buzzingbee
*A widow and former professor at the University
AllTheGoodOnesWereGone
Also, not "unexpectedly" (her late husband was one of the BH founders along with Buffett) and she got a lot more than just the $1B she gave to the medical school.
mybuddyeric
Just for perspective, $1bn of BRK.A is like 1,600 shares. Absolutely insane.
smashpro1
Her husband was a very early investor, due to being good friends with Warren Buffett.
mrsdowneyjr
Oddly it only pays for 1600 students
braechnov
"Finally"... Bill Gates donated his entire fortune to curing disease in Africa over 20 years ago AND started the Giving Pledge to encourage other billionaires to donate to good causes. There's about 600b pledged so far. People still think he's trying to implant microchips in them.
somerandomusernamething
Gates does better than most billionaires, but he still isn't good. His malaria push in Africa is based on good intentions, but the result from it's restricted actions is a big part of why aids is so prevalent in many areas of the continent. He also donated nowhere near his entire fortune as he still has a 137 billion net worth. That much could solve hunger and homelessness in the US without much of a dent.
braechnov
It's a pledge, so happens over time https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jul/15/bill-gates-billions-fotune-donate-foundation - I haven't heard the link between malaria and HIV and couldn't find it with a search, could you share some info please?
IAmASentientWaffle
Yeah, hate to break it to ya, but if you dig a little deeper into his foundation you'll find out that there's a lot wrong with their methods. Ultimately it's just another way of sponsoring Big Pharma, mostly. Also, don't forget the Oxford vaccine scandal.
By and large, rich folks doing charity is still mostly self-serving.
braechnov
Yeah I wasn't delighted with his take on the vaccine piece.
I guess if we've moved from a "billionaires never do any good" criticism to "well that one does good but some of his foundation's methods aren't great" criticism, thats progress of a sort, even if it does feel slightly humbuggy.
He seems to be in competition with big pharma? https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL16109805/
IAmASentientWaffle
There are several sources cited on the Foundation's Wikipedia page that refute that (plus a bunch of other issues of course). And I'm guessing that's just the tip of the iceberg if you were to go down the rabbit hole.
mike13815
Invested at 10% (conservatively) that's $100M/year return, enough for about 1600 students, twice the university's current enrollment. After
mike13815
figuring in NYS, federal, and local tuition programs, that's about 2600 students they could fund -forever- and still increase by 7%/year.
manystripes
Thank you for this perspective, I was skeptical about the "forever" part since it seemed an entire med school's worth of students must be a lot to cover, but now I understand!
mike13815
My numbers were actually incorrect. It being a charitable foundation means standard market rates don't apply - they could do *even more*
haggerton
Covering med student's tuitions is a stupid move. They are the group least likely to not be able to pay back their student loans. Give it to nursing instead.
anyrandom0
There’s a shortage of nurses and doctors. Instead of giving free tuition to anyone they should have founded a new university to train more nurses and doctors.
DrMardini
what it will help with is allowing med students to choose specialties they are passionate about even if they have less earning potential because they arent burdened with a half million or more in debt. We need primary care doctors in this country and a lot of med students choose to specialize and subspecialize to pay the bills. (and if they aren't passionate about their subspecialty they tend to be the biggest assholes in the hospital since they are miserable)
dobe0TieDancer
Meh, nurses are in the top 5% earners where I live. Give it to the Rad techs instead.
haggerton
Interesting. Here in QC we have a nursing crisis cuz the health minister (who's a specialist doc) took the nursing budget to give a pay raise to specialist docs (who I assure you did not need a pay raise, even the specialist docs themselves protested the move).
BestUsernameICouldThinkOf
FeelingButter
That one was hard to watch.
DeanGulberri1
AdamH4
My wife can’t watch this episode 😆
fartyandbloated
Literally the one episode I can’t watch.
Snooj
I don't come here to be hurt.
IWantYourSecretsUnlessTheyAreCoveredInBees
As someone who does not know, can you explain the context?
[deleted]
[deleted]
IWantYourSecretsUnlessTheyAreCoveredInBees
Holy heck I did not want to see that painful awkwardness
stronomer
One could simply just fund universities to educate doctors for the public good from - hear me out! - tax money. Then one wouldn't need to rely on donations from billionaires to not have them leave college with a crushing debt. Just a thought. Works in other countries.
AranaDiscoteca
Having that much money is inherently immoral. It's not necessary. So if you get that much money what should you do with it?
muffmunchies
I don't think the argument is against donating to public good but rather that public good shouldn't depend on those donations to pause the dystopian torments occasionally.
AranaDiscoteca
But, no one was suggesting that public good should depend on donations. So it's a counter to an argument no one was making or suggesting
muffmunchies
Nobody is suggesting that it should be that way because it already is effectively that way (at least in America) government has gutted public services and supports to the bare minimum of what can be called a service or altered it's function to generate profits as a higher priority than assisting and elevating the vulnerable people it's meant to serve. What we currently have is relevant to discussing what should be as these systems tend to only work as advertised when wealthy people get involved.
stronomer
Of course it is, if the alternative is people not studying because they face "crushing debt" if they do.
AranaDiscoteca
I was unclear. No one has suggested that in this conversation. We seem to have created a character - we'll call them Evil McShitty - to argue against. But no one was supporting Mx. McShitty. And while McShitty's views do live up to their name and while I agree with the sentiment... Creating a persona and arguing against them only serves the purpose of strawmanning for internet points.
Randomice
See how simple it can be?
Tigersterne
My back of the napkin math: her husband would have had to put $500,000 in Berkshire Hathaway stock the day it went public 1984) for it to be worth a billion today.
braechnov
In 2000, Bill Gates donated basically his entire fortune ($69b so far) to curing disease for the world's poorest in Africa, rather than funding soon to be rich med students in the USA. People still think he's trying to implant microchips in them.
Leithoa
"Gates donated basically his entire fortune...$69B". Bill Gates current NW: $148B. I'm no banker but 69 is less than 148. It would seem he has not in fact donated his entire net worth. Nor is donating money to non-profits you control a selfless act. "Rather than funding soon to be rich med students" HAH! You don't know what you're talking about. https://averagedoctor.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/image-1024x633.png
braechnov
It's a pledge, so he donates over time https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jul/15/bill-gates-billions-fotune-donate-foundation
I mean... if you compare even quite heavily indebted med students in the USA against malaria sufferers in Africa... ?
Leithoa
Yeah, I'm aware of his "give it away when I die" promise. I'm saying it doesn't matter cause he's an exploitative piece of shit now.
braechnov
Genuinely interested to hear why you think that? I wasn't delighted by his reaction around COVID vaccines, but is there something more?
smashpro1
And he is 58 billion dollars RICHER than when he started donating!
braechnov
It's a pledge.. He donates more over time: https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jul/15/bill-gates-billions-fotune-donate-foundation
Snuffdigit
It takes on average between 5-20 years to pay off medical school, so I wouldn’t describe them as “soon to be rich” but I agree bill gates gets shit in more than he should.
braechnov
I mean... Compared to the suffering poor in Africa? :-)
Leithoa
Gates gets way less shit than he should. He's a monopolistic douche canoe who exploits every person in his business.
braechnov
He left Microsoft in 2000. Which company are you referring to?
Qpnao
Microsoft has also supplied a lot of military software that killed lots of people. You could argue that they didn't dictate policy, but I think it is often a two way street with lobbying
braechnov
Gates hasn't been involved with Microsoft since 2000.
Snuffdigit
I mean by the same logic they also supplied the software that saved a lot of people.
Qpnao
That doesn't really "balance the scales", no, because human lives aren't transferable. That's why murder is still illegal no matter how good of a person you may otherwise be. (I'm sure Harold Shipman sometimes practiced actual medicine... he's still a serial killer). Nobody should be killing anyone else (unless it's absolutely necessary for someone's safety). People *especially* shouldn't be contributing to death for the sake of profit.
SirDrPoopfaceEsquire
In addition to the education loan debt, people also forget that there are years of lost income potential to make up for during extended training periods required for medical education. Finally getting a real job at 35-40 means that someone working a trade during that same amount of time had a lot more time to generate wealth.
gypsyspot
most doctors don't begin collecting their first income at 40 years of age.
AnyUsernameWillDoForMe
Mmm I’m torn on it though. A very rich person gets a huge tax write off for subsidising her priorities. She also gets fawned over and called a hero. All to make medical graduates (some of the future 5%) a little bit better off.
yakiudon
Slow clap. You are awesome.
AranaDiscoteca
I'm sorry are you... against *checks notes* medical graduates?
RealTurdFerguson
At least it’s a noble profession, sir, or madame
BarryTheCyborg
She's a widow that inherited the money. It's not like she's the one who "earned" it off the backs of underpaid employees.
RealTurdFerguson
At least it’s a noble profession, sir, or madame
Randomice
People who will go on to make other people healthier. A nice knock-on effect that may last generations. Cool, isn't it. :)
AnyUsernameWillDoForMe
Yea I did say I was torn.
DadOnTheInternet
Good thing there’s going to be an influx of DR’s to patch you up now. You no longer have to be torn apart
Paradox1111
It will lower the financial bar enough so that some who may never have the means to go to medical school.. will now be able
TheWhiteWolfofWallstreet
And there will be less barrier for people to enter lower paying, but much needed, medical specialties like primary care if they don’t have $250-$500k of loans to worry about.
Thanlarkis
3PiecesOfBread
Aaaannnnd…
Thanlarkis
And party on dudes!
firlefranz
DukeDarkwood
firlefranz
Aaaannnnd?
harthram
Party on, dudes?
3PiecesOfBread
cptcr
And to be a downer, let's see how long it takes the school to increase tuition
JoeT85
that was my first thought is that they'll try to find a way to soak her for all her money.
Wrinkle666
She did her due dilligence and hired an entire team to stop fee gouging .
backrideup9
I put my money on the people she entrusts to keep the fund going just steals it all.
Woestkonijn
When I went back to school I got funded out of a huge trust that was setup by two people who had sold their company and didn't know what to do with that amount of money. Those fund people were absolutely serious and vetted me with a application talk and everything. Your distrust tells me you are either a cynical person or someone who has been very hurt by things like this.
Sometimes people are good.
nclu
It would also be a huge win to lift the residency caps that were put in place under Reagan. A portion of our costs are that we let the AMA legislate a shortage of practitioners.
BDBottom
GE brings bad things to life! (for the young'uns, Reagan was a General Electric shill before he was a billionaire simp)
dumbdumbdirtybum
Like Wendy's?
cptcr
yes, like the time the billionaire paid for everyone's wendy's and then they raised prices. exactly that
dumbdumbdirtybum
Doobiedog
Every other first world country provides free tuition. The US is so fucking stupid.
Inmate45
Australian here - nope, this is something we've got in common with the USA unfortunately. We get loans called HELP, which don't get interest but do get indexed every year. And an undergrad degree is $20k+.
RealMattGreer
Free? So where does the tuition money come from, exactly? I mean, uni professors have to eat, right?
EricPisch
UK - Unis can charge upto £9250 per year for a degree, there is a goverment backed loan scheme
Woestkonijn
Yeah it's not free but our government (NL) has some very attractive loans and scholarships at hand. The American system is an atrocity.
rusrsdude
Iirc Canada doesnt, and some of Europe don't either. But affordable for both with govt help as well
Heisanevilgenius
Tuition is hella expensive in Canada too. Part of why I never went to college
Zuanartha
Start replacing the word "free" with "paid for by taxes". We collectively pay for things that we benefit from as a whole society. Make it the norm to speak out loud what our taxes are supposed to be used for.
Nectarinebutthole
This is where taxes should go not mansions for government officials. The fact that I'm American and pay taxes and literally have nothing to show for it pisses me off to levels that will put me in a padded room.
Thewayofthebear
Not free here, but affordable.
TheMobilePengwing
Im guessing 1 year to have the layeers find a way to appropriate it.
pomax
Appropriate... what? Her late husband's stock portfolio?
backrideup9
The payments from the stock that funds the gift... so roundabout yes.
pomax
You're going to have to put in a lot more work if you want people to believe that "the lawyers" would even be able to get their hands on contractually earmarked endowment money.
KuldFyt
Per the article she's an emerita clinician, so she's likely savvy enough to know that she needs, and connected enough to access substantial legal resources that will make the endowment conditional on the maintenance of free tuition. Most Universities are *very* protective of endowments, so this stands a good chance of lasting for a while.
AdamKetchupp
Heh heh...
Endowment...
TK421isAFK
Think of it this way: The school probably has 100 med students a year. 1 year might cost $100k. That's $10M, or 1% of the money. Even 1/2
TK421isAFK
investing it into a very slow-growth fund could yield better than 1% annually, but without investing it at all, a regular bank account 2/3
TK421isAFK
would pay at least that much. Even with no interest, that's still 100 years of tuition. 3/3
ZachariasWolfe
Your "even with no interest" still assumes it's being invested in a way that matches inflation. 100 years is a lot of inflation.
certainlynotaserialkiller
the reddit math people aready figured out that it will basically never run out.
lurkingforeternity
Taking a conservative 4%, that’s 40 Million per year only in interest
explainer
How does that work? Sorry uneducated
UWAGAGABLAGABLAGABA
You should apply to that school
TakeAChillPill16
Compound interest. If the endowment is invested conservatively, it'll make tens of millions of dollars every year to cover that year's tuition for all students. In a good year, it'll grow.
Justawanderinggoat
Link?
cbjfan
certainlynotaserialkiller
reddit.com
theplantladyisabenevolentruler
KuldFyt
That's usually how endowments are set up in academia. They don't run down, they end when someone fucks up.
RubusUrsinus
Yup. This is also why "but X school clearly has enough money for Y thing" isn't quite as meaningful as it sounds; it could buy Y thing now, but it'd have to cut scholarship programmes & faculty lines to do so. Not saying unis actually have their spending priorities straight most of the time, just that spending down capital is a good way to make sure they won't be around long enough to straighten them out. (The alternative of course is comprehensively & reliably public-funded higher ed).
zackingsman
Whoa there speedy, don't be proposing communism or anything now!