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In Russia’s isolated and remote region of Siberia, an underground economic boom is taking shape. Radio Free Europe photographer Amos Chapple, back in 2016, went inside the dark world of the Russian men illegally mining for tusks and remains of the long-extinct woolly mammoth, in hopes of cashing in on black market trade. The images he captured show a compelling cycle of toil, desperation, and environmental consequence.
Woolly mammoths, lost arctic relatives of the modern elephant, are thought to have lived in Siberia about 400,000 years ago. The area now experiences year-round permafrost, a thick layer of ice beneath the ground, which has helped to preserve submerged mammoth skeletons for millennia. In order to reach the buried treasures of this hostile land, the men seeking it have to blast the thick, icy mud with water pumped from nearby rivers, which can take months on end. It’s a dangerous, illegal, and taxing job, but with mammoth tusks selling at around $35k a piece to eager Chinese buyers, it’s a worthwhile risk to men coming from cities where the average monthly wage is under $500.
It’s not all diamonds and glory, however. The men setting out on tusk hunts leave their families behind to brave rugged terrain, hoards of mosquitoes, and constant fear of detection by police, which could result in fines or jail sentences. They guzzle quarts of vodka and cheap beer to cope with the ordeal, leading to frequent fights among miners. Perhaps worst of all is the toll their work takes on the environment; the run-off water from the frozen earth they douse returns to the surrounding rivers, polluting water streams and raising silt levels dramatically.
Take in the entire series below, accompanied by Chapple’s own commentary as written in his RFE article, and witness the plight of men craving to get rich, and willing to die trying.
“With the sale of elephant tusks under close scrutiny, “ethical ivory” from the extinct woolly mammoth is now feeding much of China’s hunger for tusks. Every summer, bands of tusk hunters head into the Russian wilderness in the hopes of striking it rich. On condition I not reveal names or exact locations, I gained access to one site where teams of men are using illegal new methods in the hunt for what remains of Siberia’s lost giants”, wrote photographer Amos Chapple
“Four hours by speedboat from the nearest village…” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“…is a bend in the river riddled with mammoth remains.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“A paleontologist I spoke to said this site was likely once a swamp or bog which drowned prehistoric beasts.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“The tuskers use water pumps designed for firefighting (Tohatsu are the preferred brand) to suck water out of the river..” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“…and blast it into the landscape.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“Some tuskers carve long, deep tunnels (which are terrifying – the walls are as soft as garden soil).” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“Others use the cutting power of the hoses to carve huge underground caverns.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“And some gouge channels straight through the topsoil.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“In the hope of finding one of these – a perfectly preserved mammoth tusk, worth around $520 per kilogram.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“A little background: Siberia’s Yakutia region sits on a foundation of permafrost – permanently frozen soil which lies a few feet below the surface.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“In warm soil, bones would rot away within a decade. But tusks and bones like this mammoth hip can survive tens of thousands of years once locked into the permafrost, making Yakutia a mammoth mecca.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“This 65-kilogram tusk, photographed a few minutes after it was plucked from the permafrost, was sold for $34,000. The two men who found it unearthed three more in just over a week, including one weighing 72 kilograms.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“The lucky tuskers flashing a “cash” gesture. They likely earned around $100,000 in eight days.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“That kind of money in a region where the average salary is around $500 a month, doesn’t always buy a happy ending. This memorial is for two young tuskers who made more than $100k, partied hard, then allegedly returned up the river drunk. They flipped their boat and drowned.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“In the tuskers’ hometown, elusive “agents” pay cash for fresh tusks. These plastic-wrapped tusks are on a flight to the city of Yakutsk, en route to China. This haul was covered with a tarpaulin, when I looked under it the air stewardess yelled at me, then marched down the aisle and slapped my camera out of my hand right after I took this photo.”(Image credits: Amos Chapple)
"But it’s not just mammoths that the men uncover. This skull belongs to a bison which which once roamed Siberia’s plains.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“And this skull, helping to prop up a kettle, is from a woolly rhinoceros.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“Another rhino skull, feeling the sun on its snout for the first time in at least 11,000 years. The man who found it says that “when you find a skull, the horn is usually 15 or 20 meters away.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“This 2.4-kilogram rhino horn was sold to an agent for $14,000. It will probably end up in Vietnam, be ground into powder and marketed as medicine.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“The damp horn squelches like driftwood and smells like a dirty dog. The “cancer curing” rhino horn will be worth more than its weight in gold once it reaches Vietnam.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“But for most tuskers, a whole summer of labour in the gluey mud will end up losing them money.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“As the pumps roar through tons of gasoline, most brigades will only turn up worthless bones like these. Dr. Valery Platnikov, a paleontologist familiar with this tusking site, estimates “only around 20-30 percent [of tuskers] will make a profit. It’s very sad… A lot of these guys have taken out bank loans to pay for these expeditions.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“To keep his expedition cheap, this young tusker converted the engine from a Soviet-era Buran snowmobile into a water pump.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“When the Siberian winter kicks in, the engine will be returned to the town and refitted into its snowmobile.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“The life: Most men here will spend the entire summer away from home and family.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“In the gloom of their tents, the tuskers chill with card games or share a phone to watch short viral videos or porn.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“This tusker penned letters to his wife that he passed on to other men headed back to the town, this is a letter from his wife – the first news he’d had from her in a week.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“This joint of reindeer is a rare treat. Most meals are canned beef and noodles. Two of the tuskers told me they eat dog “when we have to… The flavour is like bacon.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“Mosquitoes are a near constant plague. Only the coldest mornings offer an hour or two of relief.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“On warm days, some of the men wear clothes more suited to beekeeping than hard labour.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“And when the alcohol comes out, all hell breaks loose. Returning from a resupply run to town, these tuskers have made it halfway back to camp staggering drunk. But soon after this picture was taken their trip went off the rails.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“Near the spot where the 2015 drowning took place, these tuskers crashed their boat at speed. A 3 a.m. rescue mission found them passed out in a boat full of waterlogged equipment.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“And the drinking continued the next day. Basically whenever booze arrived in the camp it would be drunk until it was gone, then after one day of sleeping it off the men would get back to work.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“The damage: Ravaged landscape is the obvious result of the tusk hunters’ methods, but the impact on Yakutia’s waterways is taking a heavy toll. The runoff from the tuskers’ hoses runs back into the river, filling it with silt. The fish from the river near our tusking site were gone – the men no longer even bother to take fishing rods.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“One tusker told me, “I know it’s bad, but what can I do? No work, lots of kids.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
“But the number of tuskers in the Yakutia region is increasing every year, and as more stories of instant, spectacular wealth filter back to the towns, that trend is likely to continue.” (Image credits: Amos Chapple)
Sauce: http://www.boredpanda.com/mammoth-tusk-hunting-russia/?page_numb=4&utm_source=CB8&utm_medium=link&utm_campaign=SAW
Note from OP: hope you have enjoyed the above 'article'! Huge respect to the photographer for his bravery in showing the world about this sad trade.
theitinerantnaturalist
What a stupid black market trade
Angrywanker
When greedy bastards team up with useful idiots to destroy our planet.
themojoe2
Literally everything about this sucks, except the photographer's work to expose it.
RadioactiveLobster
There are two episodes of Expedition Unknown that also show this, "Cloning the Woolly Mammoth" and "Journey to the Ice Age".
Orwellwasright1984
Quicky read title. Saw 'illegal, get rich, get drunk" and immediately knew it was somewhere in Russia .
notasinglewhitefemale
Thank you
HashtagDadJokes
So much to make a Chinese man think he is more potent in bed.
ObiWanShalomi
Can confirm. Have big dick.
pachyderm
Interesting and infuriating.
Goofychems
Icomehereforthecommentsection
Good post! Didn't even know this was a thing
CPolofVancouver
Chinese traditional medicine and their obsession with saving face is so environmentally destructive; it disgusts me
Flyndaran
Western capitalism isn't better. Humans are shit regardless of magical thinking, greed, or shortsighted willful ignorance.
PMmeYourFeetLadies
I was always told that mammoth ivory was legal and elephant ivory was illegal.
ImpoliteCanadian
The zombie apocalypse will come from southeast Asia... they ingest as medicine things that probably carry forgotten diseases
AwaitingForYouAllInHell
Guess what. I'm coming from the future. I have some bad news...
Reactiveisland5
Ironically, in most zombie movies it does come from Asia.
Bumhunter90
I really hope the whole crew gets swallowed by one of their soil tunnels.
HypnoButler
And then later we can dig them up and sell their dicks to the Chinese!
Merced
Interesting, I wish these were being preserved instead of ground into bull shit medicine though.
YourFriendlyNeighbourhoodEcologist
My heart cried at the wooly rhino skull being used to prop up a campfire...
WinstonsLeftTesticle
There is probably quite some useable DNA left in those teeth. Diging it up from the permafrost destroys it... Damn shame.
Memes4Cheap
preserved for what? we have plenty of those to fuel a whole season of hoarders
80percentlegs
WeDemandRigidlyDefinedAreasOfDoubtAndUncertainty
Better those than live elephant tusks and rhino horns, though.
FurciferPardalis
This just helps, not hinder, the drive in the market for those as well though.
tornbetweenscyllaandcovfefe
Whilst I feel for the horrible cruelty elephants and rhinos are put through, mammoths are extinct and there is no way to replace those tusks
JSid
Too many kids? Maybe don't have so many kids if you can't afford them!
thxph
It's possible he lost his job after he had the kids.
ISuperBelieveInYouTadCooper
While I agree with the logic, it's unlikely they have access to reliable birth control or sex ed.
Dmancman
Is it just me or the Chinese are responsible for allot of the worlds problems...no sense of anything other than themselves.
CleverUsernameWasTaken
It'd make sense as to why they've been around for so long.
Flyndaran
Magical thinking is human nature, sadly. This is just how some eastern nations express it. Every nation has their own version.
Madhouse5213
it's a shame people need to do this to make a living over there
GerhardRammelhausen
And 70% of them don't even make a living.
Sheiryn
Ivory trade is ridiculous. If they want to stop the killing they need to sell the confiscated ivory on the open market at a reduced rate 1/2
Sheiryn
then put the money back into conservation. make it pointless to poach for ivory. The animals are already dead, make their deaths matter.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Sheiryn
lol right but my point still makes sense. if you sell legal ivory the black market for it will fall away.
makeyourownpath
Great piece, I had no idea this was happening. Thanks.
BreastInspector
Sounds like at a rate of 60 tons a year http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2013/04/125-mammoth-tusks/larmer-text
mdtrep
The real winner is the guy selling all that cheap booze
mdtrep
Then again it's Russia...this is probably the case all over the country
Strongharbour432
Little shocking to believe that they were actually worse off not too long ago, and they had the lovely canibalism period as well
MillennialCollector
This sounds like it would be a really interesting TV series.
westwood8183
They did an episode about it on Expedition Unknown. It was fascinating and terrifying. Would recommend!
saltypopsiclesaltandsweet
Nat geo should be all over this
tbranno4
So is it only illegal because of the water pumping? Or is it illegal to find and sell the tusks?
ButtblasterMcAssmaster
Yeah, I was wondering about that too. Trading mammoth in itself isn't illegal, unlike elephant ivory.
dieselpunk
It's illegal to drink that much booze, even in Russia.
sleepyimgurian
With the internet...how can people b so incredibly ignorant to think it has med benefits? These r people with $$$$ not poor folk. Fools.
omglandshark
With the internet people only become more intelligent if they are capable and willing. Sticking to an old view takes no effort at all.
apoohneicie
Who said having money makes you any smarter?
amberingo
Oh god. As an archaeologist who works with Pleistocene remains, this actually makes my heart hurt.
YourFriendlyNeighbourhoodEcologist
As a fellow scientist, I to, feel the ache.
apoohneicie
I feel for you.
amberingo
So many things wrong. The destruction of context, the destruction of the land and ecosystem, the blatant disregard for the past, 1/2
amberingo
The fact that these poor people even need to participate in this to live, the fact that it just cycles… 2/2
Smallbrownrabbit
Sad. I am more and more disgusted with the markets need for 'magic powders'. Just 3D print a rhino horn and be done with it,
DoWnVoTeToThEkNeE
I just ate an entire seahorse!
crustyblankets
I worry more about the living creatures that are being hunted for remedies. They can keep the bones.
kuhraezah
You're so smart. You just saved the day.
gollom
The demand isn't for decoration. It's for quack boner pills and cancer meds. 3d printing won't help there.
MyBrainIsPlastiDipped
Some of the better quality mammoth tusks get carved with intricate designs. Source:National Geographic magazine
boogiemanspud
http://www.snopes.com/3d-printed-rhino-horn-developed
CirB
Sure it will. Do a few convincing fakes from poisonous material, sell them to quacks. See everyone getting wary after a few deaths.
Salmonthegreat
Or just do it with non-lethal things so we don't murder people but still föood the marker with fakes. And give the harvesters proper jobs.
Salmonthegreat
Flood*
ScaryTransgenderPersonInTheRestroom
Have you ever heard of bad meth? Those people are addicted to their beliefs and addicts don't care about the risks.
Spamamdorf
Pretty sure there's a lot of problems with knowingly poisoning people
HelloMax
So kill the person with cancer who is desperate for any cure?
CirB
If s/he is desperate enough to knowingly doom others by his/her desperation, s/he's got to take the risk.
afriendofmine
yes.
TheCrazyVulcan
And then we can move on to the parents that wont give their kids medical treatment because they believe God will save them for their faith.
Gobblemewl
They're actually doing that though. Trying to flood the market with fakes.
Thundering165
Better to just flood the market with Viagra
Smallbrownrabbit
Thereby bringing down the prices. Ah science.
Satherian
*economics, to be specific
AlcoholicsAnonymousBYO
Use this one crazy trick to fake out tusk traders!
lighterletter
Click here to find out how!
funkmaster40
This also brings more people into the market. The only way to truly stop it is to get rid of the demand.
furomustela
This is true. It doesn't solve the problem because people keep looking for the "real stuff" from a trusted source.
Gobblemewl
Flood the market with poisoned horns, people will stop buying, when they see people dropping dead.
justahumanbeing
They need to flood the market with Doctors and scientists explaining that it doesnt do jack shit for you and its an old myth to lower buyers
TheCrazyVulcan
Given the chance of long medical treatment that may not work. Or a oneshot if expensive magic powder and prayer, many will take the gamble
10tacles
Just like how scientists explained Global Warming to the American government? And those people supposedly had a better education.
YouCantHaveMyHouse
Like they are going to listen to some doctors and scientist.
JamBarn
I think many likely would.
10tacles
Just like how scientists explained Global Warming to the American government? And those people supposedly had a better education.
Shargan8
I have a very interesting story about people's historic resilience and dislike towards scientists, but it can't fit here.
sharmeethius
There are some interesting articles about preserved bacteria and viruses in permafrost and what can happen when permafrost is disrupted 1/2
sofacoin
As long as there's no prehistoric wasps, we should be alright.
sharmeethius
Yeah that is something I should not have googled...
ImpoliteCanadian
brb need to google now
sharmeethius
http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20170504-there-are-diseases-hidden-in-ice-and-they-are-waking-up (2/2)
Youareobscure
Pavlovia
LompHoofd
ScaryTransgenderPersonInTheRestroom
"No work, lots of kids"... THEN STOP FUCKING HAVING KIDS. I hate mf's that use their sex drive as an excuse to fuck up everyone else's shit
ICantPeelMyFaceWhenImWithYou
Well, there are plenty of traditional (herbal) methods to prevent/curtail pregnancy.
mustachefleas
Seriously. I say just don't have kids or control yourself a little better and people just blow up on me
auscaliber
If they're controlling themselves enough to blow up ON you how are they having so many kids?
CirB
Sadly as has been proven pretty much everywhere, abstinence doesn't work, and these guys probably have no money or access to preventation.
d0o0o0d
ScaryTransgenderPersonInTheRestroom
Wow, think of all the aborted fetuses flushed down the toilet. #SoSad
ScaryTransgenderPersonInTheRestroom
You could use Texas as proof that abstinence is a bad joke at best- might as well pray that you don't get pregnant, it's just as effective.
GavinScreaming
Yes abstinence has proven to work so well over human history.
ScaryTransgenderPersonInTheRestroom
Abstinence is a joke, but there are too many people, we either figure out how to slow down the birth rate or we will over populate and die.
GavinScreaming
Education and money. Pretty much every first world country has much slower or even negative birth rates
YouCantHaveMyHouse
It would be awesome if someone figured a way to cause non-permanent infertility to everyone born. With easy reversal and no side-effects.
YouCantHaveMyHouse
But then again, someone would use such a thing to rid the earth of unwanted people.
YouCantHaveMyHouse
But then again, so many people really shouldn't procreate at all or at least in their circumstances.
Flyndaran
We all agree on that, but not who has the right or objectivity to enforce their judgment on who that may be.
Tinebra
That's something I always say too! Too many people shouldn't procreate for many reasons, I hope someone is working on that.
reverendbonobo
Yeah, that's going to work. We'll just convince poor people to stop fucking. Why has nobody thought of this before?
ScaryTransgenderPersonInTheRestroom
Crazy tho- these people can't control their sex drive and have babies they can't feed, but if a guy has sex with a guy everyone freaks. Wtf?
reverendbonobo
If only we could convince them all to take up gay sex, we could cut down on that excess population.
ScaryTransgenderPersonInTheRestroom
:)
TeSoad90
THIS ^
Dramacian
#30 Those feet...
fathersisterberzerker
kofjfsfsf
I got blackout drunk while camping one time and woke up in the middle of the night to a sight like that on my legs but decided to just
kofjfsfsf
go to sleep again and the next morning i had 200 stings on my legs. but ever since i am pretty much immune to the stings. Worked out i guess
Dramacian
Hopefully the ButtFairy had time to do its business without you noticing.
kofjfsfsf
I don't know about your friends but we tend to not rape each other when we get drunk.
Dramacian
Fairy business is no human business. Leaves only presents.
brrrackobama
This photo triggered a primal response to flee. If you've ever been swarmed, you know what I mean. Such an odd kind of terror.
PlutoIX
https://img.gifmagazine.net/gifmagazine/images/963770/original.gif?1477406957
Gear1solidx
Shickzilla
On the bus, so...
mrDword
parpy
http://imgur.com/Ai0YGVb
Dramacian
Same reaction... why don't people do something for their toenails ?
hugohugoyeayea
That's what made me stop and start reading
negoshi8
I can almost smell them
ObiWanShalomi
Step 1: Cut off foot. Step 2: Put foot on fire. Step 3: Put body on fire.
TheStoneMask
I am so grateful there are no mosquitos here in Iceland (yet)...
KeyMasher
Hendlton
Do you think I could still earn a profit if I rented a flamethrower and ALL the fuel for it?
Danielv1234
I doubt you will find a place to rent fuel.
Canmyusernamebethesizeofyourdickibetitcantbecauseitssolittle
I wonder how people with foot-fetish feel about this...
TK421isAFK
Their tongues itch, probably.
PMmeYourFeetLadies
-5/10
TheWhitestFang
They're good feet, Brent
anotherpersonhere
I feel unhappy
Nawoi
intimidated
BlastFX
Since there seem to be very few women with foot fetish, probably indifferent.
TheGirlInTheFireplace
Foot fetishist here. I wanna gouge out my eyes.
sulfuratus
Ribbed for her pleasure
Rekthobo
@Cheesewick
MonkWho
I've been to Siberia multiple times (at a research station about 800km north of Krasnoyarsk). Can confirm the amount of mosquitoes. 1/?
MonkWho
I remember walking in the woods with someone and I could see that the back of the jacket in front of me was covered in the damn suckers 2/?
MonkWho
So it looked like their back was slightly rippling because of it. Those damn mosquitoes were not scared of anything 3/?
MonkWho
And would easily penetrate couple layers of loose clothing to bite you. 4/4
BlastFX
Well, there go my plans to visit Siberia.
fireeternal
What about off and that kind of products, do they work?
overcookedchickennugget
This is a nightmare if you are allergic to mosquitos bites.
daewookie
anybody in whom a mosquito bite site swells and becomes itchy (standard histamine reaction) is allergic to mosquito bites
godofpencilshavings
Isn't everyone allergic to their bites
flamingflamingo
are you not?
fantasticjack
I went night fishing a few days ago and there's about 30 bites just on one foot. Not even Benadryl 6x a day completely gets rid of the hives
PeteThePerv
This is a nightmare.
DetectiveSherlockHolmes
A nightmare
lncorrectGrammerNazi
Regardless of allergies.
GoldenSun3DS
Username... Doesn't check out?
lncorrectGrammerNazi
Our you sure?
Frappo
When I get bites, the swelling can get up to about 2 inches in diameter. If this happened to me, it'd absolutely wreck my feet.
leeloumultipass
That's called Skeeter Syndrome (mosquito bite allergy). I have that too. 2 inch diameter area of swelling, feelings hot to the touch.
onikazey
I get the same thing along with the mound turning near purple/black hate them so much.
skinnysethrogan
We are all slightly allergic to mosquito saliva, it's what causes the histamine reaction that makes us itch
Flyndaran
What reaction? They don't itch or cause any reaction in me. I can't even feel them bite.
yamigrl
Allergies =/= reactions. Allergies are different because they are a hypersensitivity to something that usually causes little to no (1/2)
Gibenitural
While your basically right, histamine is involved in both. An uncontrolled reaction forms the allergy or anaphalytic shock.
yamigrl
problem in the average human. I'm allergic to mosquitoes while most people I know simply exhibit a reaction.
Flyndaran
What reaction? They don't itch or cause any reaction in me. I can't even feel them bite.
acme64
whats the symptom?
apoohneicie
I just don't understand killing endangered wildlife or taking fossil specimens to use for bullshit fake ass medicine. Makes my blood boil.
SDog08939
The black bear is getting hit on the east coast too. Now that it's so hard to get ivory they're moving on to new aimals
Stuebydoo
licking a tiger penis would help with that
HighFunctioningAlcoholic
The only bad thing I see here is the environmental damage. Those animals aren't getting more dead.
VoiceOfVerisimilitude
Yeah they could simply ask their parents for money. Dumbasses!
ShamnusMcfee
It's what happens when you combine ignorance with desperation.
MonsieuRoberts
Superstition and faith is strength in the east. Has always been, will always be.
BreadyStinellis
Desperation. if people were willing to pay you enough to have your family set for years when otherwise you'd be struggling.
apoohneicie
But their family isn't set, they have to pay back those loans they took out to go digging in the first place.
inboxmefoxes
Frankly, we've learned most of what's there to learn regarding mammoths, short of cloning them. These specimens were unlikely to be dug up.
orangecicle
Things like this are why I hate China.
laggythetree
You know this stuff is harvested and sold legally in North America right? its illegal in russia because the right people dont make the money
Radix865
I still think stealing fossils is slightly better than poaching.
KarenFromTheHOA
Yeah, but only slightly, though.
SlaaneshTentacles
Better that than virgins blood
justahumanbeing
I just checked, and rhino horn is more expensive than extinct rhino horn? Are these guys getting screwed on price? Is $550 a kilo correct?
GTimgur
When you're dying, you get desperate. Are you so far from death you find this difficult to imagine? We're surrounded by cognitive dissonance
apoohneicie
No actually I have been VERY close to death. Stage IV cancer is no joke.
GTimgur
Then why do you find it difficult to imagine?
MerToo
Yeah, you'd think they'd just put on their Magic Job Hats and fly away to Magic Job Land where Magic Jobs grow on Magic Job Trees...
FartedWhileMakingUpName
I've been there. It's nice but the people are super racist :/
NIA666
You sound like that chick who wrote on Instagram: "ISIS stop, like for real". Thus world crisis was averted.
apoohneicie
I didn't expect it to change anything, just sharing an opinion.
JunglePygmy
placebo effect my friend
nipplepanties
It's culture- the fuckin Chinese
ShadyC
Why does taking these bones matter? Lol.
uglybobe
China
swagcannon420
Have you tried being super poor and super desperate yet?
rfrostmiles
They're pointing out that there shouldn't be a market for this in our society. All the environment destroyed, lives lost, for nothing
DoWnVoTeToThEkNeE
You gotta do what you gotta do.. Not everyone has the luxury of environmental consciousness.
d0o0o0d
Yup. In most places, people started caring about the environment once they achieved some prosperity. Impoverished people focus on survival.
justahumanbeing
Not true in their case. With the amount of money and hard labour these guys spend, they could do a ton of different things to make money.
SkeletonsNeedLoveToo
Could you raise a family on less than 5000 a year?
whatsisname
The real offenders are the people making it lucrative to begin with: the Chinese.
z3lfmoord
Then you haven't traveled enough to understand other cultures.
notkvothethebloodless
So i should just be cool with FGM practices on women in Africa? Or indian cultures love of fucking prepubescent girls?
z3lfmoord
Have you lived/enveloped yourself in those cultures enough to understand and pass judgement?
z3lfmoord
The point is to not be narrow-minded simply because something seems strange or contradicts our own culture.
notkvothethebloodless
I guess I just have a general dislike of people oppressing/torturing/and raping women because its there 'culture'. Suppose im odd like that.
The701
Why some education is important, to at least try to deal with ignorance of snake oil. It's still not 100% effective, as evidenced by the
The701
popularity of homeopathy in the US for one thing, but it can still help. I guess people will always have a strong taste for BS, at least
The701
until real medical science can fix any ailment. But I guess even then, you'll have to work on with imagined ailments.
SwitchPup
Sometimes it's stupidity, sometimes it's desperation. When medical science fails you, you look for miracles in even the dumbest places. :-/
The701
Stupidity or ignorance is one thing. Desperation is a whole other thing. In that case, you'd have an industry thriving purely off of taking
boogiemanspud
People are dumb and some always will be. Look up fluoride in water if you want to see just how dumb.
The701
I get this stuff from certain family members already, but not too deep into the conspiracy theory stuff, yet.
NotTheChad
Same here, this stuff belongs in museums. What a waste to powder it and snort it or whatever.
CandleBruh
I cant help but wonder when or who would actually get around to digging these tusks up if these guys werent doing it
TepidTea
While a disgusting waste, I still feel it's better than people killing elephants for their ivory
kholli
Oh, they're still doing that too. The demand for ivory and rhino horn is never ending.
TepidTea
That's true! However until an effective solution is found I think that minimalising the damage shpuld.be imperative
MemeDissector
then again, even museums seem kinda wasteful. they're only there to be looked at, nothing else. really there's no good use for fossils.
clawthewolf
Dude, museums are used for research as well, not just showing off. They have massive storerooms for things not on display that is being 1/2
clawthewolf
Researched. 2/2
Millillion
I believe museum specimens are often used for scientific means, and museums often have much more than they have on display.
idontknowandidontcareeither
http://imgur.com/Oiyojux
DetectiveSherlockHolmes
Was expecting this +1
Oscill8s
http://imgur.com/v5uw3i6
cooptheplumber
How do you not understand? Same reason why people sell drugs. They need the money. They have families to support. I would do the same thing
justahumanbeing
Not true in their case. With the amount of money and hard labour these guys spend, they could do a ton of different things to make money.
boogiemanspud
The thing is, no one has money to pay them. They are getting money from china this way. Locals have no money for construction etc.
mooooooose
He doesn't understand how in modern society there's a market for it. It doesn't do anything.
whatsisname
A lot of rural China is backwards as fuck.
rfrostmiles
But at least drugs do what they're supposed to. All that damage being done is for nothing but snake oil.
flamingflamingo
I don't understand that in THIS CURRENT ERA there are still people who think ground up tusk cures cancer and impotence.
Swandiveintotheasphalt
Something like 30 percent of Americans don't know where chocolate milk comes from... just saying
flamingflamingo
7. 7 percent. According to an online survey that literally anyone could take, or give non serious responses to.
javer80
not quite. The survey had a definite sample size of ~1,000 people, and 7% said it comes from brown cows; 48% didn't know. Link to follow.
Toaster579
Thank you
JonDoe297
I say we just ship the fuckers subsidized Extenze and be done with their bullshit.
JonDoe297
They can even package the pills to look like endangered species dick, IDGAF
justahumanbeing
I say we impose the death penalty to anyone who buys, sells or trades it. Or make it legal and flood the market to value plummets...amirite?
apoohneicie
Nope makes it more rare and expensive.
GavinScreaming
No
radioGifDriver
I don't understand why anyone gives a fk about someone taking fossils to make a living. I mean people go to the chiropractor
boogiemanspud
WTF does a chiropractor have to do with anything? I guess you mean it's snake oil. Sometimes if your back is fucked it gives relief. 1/2
boogiemanspud
It's overused by many, but is legitimate to manage pain. Some chiro are snake oil salesmen, u have to find an ethical one and not a scammer.
chucknasty
I heard ground petrified moose dick is good for boiling blood
fhatpotatou
Huh...
dietz19459
Found the Canadians
legacyweaver
Or, you know, Americans, we have a shit ton of them too.
ThePowerOf42
Eh..
daewookie
Funny how westerners think China is a fount of ancient wisdom. Chinese Traditional Medicine is outrageously evil & breathtakingly stupid.
wufflewaffle
Saying CTM is bad because some believe rhino horns cure shit is like saying western medicine is bad becuz ppl think vaccines cause autism.
daewookie
BS! Rhino horns are the tip of the iceberg and absolutely NOT a fringe subset of CTM. This argument has been utterly debunked repeatedly
daewookie
& it goes far beyond conservation. EG: CTM is basis of virtually universal Chinese belief that torturing animals makes their meat healthier
Ihavewaytoomanyfavoritestosort
We had stupid "remedies," too. The difference is we got over them and accepted modern medicine.
FartedWhileMakingUpName
I mean, they were the first to invent many very important things to mankind. But yeah, the pseudoscience "medicine" scene is also ridiculous
daewookie
I'm just being honest about it. I'm Asian too (Korean) and I like Chinese people
daewookie
Even many of things came to Asia from prehistoric Europeans & Chinese govt has undertaken brazen academic fraud to destroy and conceal proof
daewookie
*of these things
missleadinginiformation
Totally believable. Do you know of any articles on the topic?
GreenYawgmoth
I hear they're pretty mercurial in their beliefs.
daewookie
CTM is almost universally believed in China. They look at nonbelievers as naïve fools. We Koreans have our own BS, but nothing so easily
GreenYawgmoth
I was making an obtuse pun based off the idea that mercury was part of an immortality potion back in ancient china.
daewookie
Oh. Duh! :D
daewookie
demonstrably false. Ever wonder why it's always got to be the most endangered species? The scarcity and value of the "medicine" makes it
daewookie
difficult to know other than anecdotally whether it "works." People who pay high prices *want* to believe that biologically inert powdered
NotACanadian
Are you sure? A lot of people aren't big fans of some of Korea's medical myths, if you catch my drift...
WateryTartan
Oh dear, you haven't even started to see what China does.
neutralcadence
We're just as bad...growth hormones, factory farms, etc. They might eat "weird" stuff, but we are in no place to judge.
endomorph
I don't think that's really comparable, except maybe how sad us humans in their many aberrations seem
BenderBendingRodriguez
Shut the fuck up.
Counterfit
I'm 40% shut the fuck up! *bang bang*
BenderBendingRodriguez
Shut up baby I know it
Counterfit
Notice how neither of those things are leading to extinction.
neutralcadence
You don't think native wildlife isn't killed or gone extinct because of grazing lands for mega stock yards? Whatever dude.
pugs911
The opposite, really
silecsound
What? Genuinely courious, what should i google
mindful22
.
gakagoat
The things they do to animals is horrific. If uou wanna have a bad time, look up the illegal tiger trade.
hyaenidae
Look up how they remove fur from Angora rabbits
ButteryButtsButterflyCups
Chinese people think that tiger penis and lion penis makes you strong.they sell it on black marketf and people eat it
zeusdemigod131
Skinning Tanuki alive for one, shark finning, eating live Octopi
SunBrolem
Bile bears. Make sure nothing breakable is near you.
NotACanadian
Bile bears
amakusav
Some even eat human fetuses because they think that's good for their dick...
ThatAssholeOverThere
Small animals like baby turtles and fish sold in little bags as keychains. The animals obviously die quickly
Strongharbour432
Slow loris
SeaTurtleSailingThroughSpace
They love Shark fin soup. It's a sign of prestige but reportedly tastes terrible.
rrlyrae
shark fins are gelatinous but have no flavor. they add expensive ingred to make it taste expensive.
IwentLookingForWhatTheBiggestIdiotHasToSayAndHereYouAre
i've had it, not knowing what it was, it wasnt bad, tastes like beef
SeaTurtleSailingThroughSpace
Interesting, you'd think it'd taste fishy.
rrlyrae
b/c they added beef.
CaptainAmericaSteveRogers
Chinese literally eat everything to make them selves more fertile, stronger, smarter etc. everything from endangered rhinos to sharks. (P1)
Therealyiannopoulos
Human horn?
CaptainAmericaSteveRogers
The Chinese government says that they are cracking down on the ivory trade this year but i wouldn't trust them.
LonLonRanchDressing
I saw a lot of ads in the subway against the ivory trade when I was there. I wondered too if they were actually making efforts to stop it.
rrlyrae
the dumbest 'logic' too. tigers are strong, ergo eating a tiger will make me strong.
doihavetobeclever
Eating a troll will make you happy.
ObiWanShalomi
Drinking crushed tiger bones will make your dick big bruhh.
Wolokos
Many cultures had (or still have) that idea. Before cell theory and randomized controlled trials came along, it made sense.