libraGiraffePoster
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Dec 19, 2017 12:29 AM
libraGiraffePoster
212411
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newsguycraigevans
The Republican party wants to end Net Neutrality. Stop voting Republican.
cheekypocketwank
How did you arrive at80%? Was there an official public vote? Or are you going on opinion polls? I am not from US, just interested.
ginniper
When you follow the masses sometimes the "m" is silent
ameliorate123
Haha. Wish I could favourite comments!
ishouldbestudyingawholelotmore
Just to be very clear, we are not a democracy.
bubthegreat
Waiting for #pornhub to start their own ISP. Funny part is It'd probably be better at blocking content than any other filtering service.
RedJudas
The United States is a Republic. The intent is to avoid mob rule. Hence representatives deciding, and an electoral college.
nabacular
Wasn't slavery supported by a large amount of Americans too?
DomZombie
Majority of people didn't want Trump, yet we still got him.
DangerTrain
But the people who voted against him didn't count as much.
ValiantToast
It's almost like voting Republican isn't in the best interest of the common U.S. citizen.
Agreeablebug6
Wait y’all fuckers still had faith in the govt..? Did you see the last election?
jjflash78
Problem is, the USA is a representative democracy. We vote the idiots in who make the idiotic decisions for us.
rlyisthisnamefree
Worst thing is that you guys manage to get people to represent you, while they do not have the majority in votes! It's broken A.F.
maniacalmacaroni
That's not how this works though. We elect representatives. If 80% of people want something but the other 20% actually voted, the 20% wins.
biolologist
That's why Democrats received ~20% more votes than Republicans did in the last election but now don't control either chamber of congress...
wonder89
The companies and their lobbyists usually win.
CrazyGuyOnABike
That's not quite how it works. We elect people who represent the company or party that pays them the most.
CardboardStomach
Would maybe be a fair comparison if all citizens' votes were equal.
Beelsebooob
Actually, it's more like if 70% of people want something, but the 30% that live in the rural states that elect 70% of senators want the 1/
Beelsebooob
oposite then tough titties to the 70%.
MericanNightmare
Pretty much this. The will of the ignorant few get more of a say than entire urban centers.
GaySocialistLiberalMuslimCommieAtheist
Yep cause two people who are far away from Each Other obviously should hold more power than four close together, murica, fuck logic.
sushiguy
It's losing a game of chess and crying because you took more pieces, and therefore should win.
HypnoChanger
Fix that problem and you just end up with California ruling the entire USA. A slight imbalance that favors small states is better than 1/
snailphotography
One American in eight lives in California. More realistically, you're looking at the top ten most populous states getting the majority vote.
snailphotography
AKA California, Texas, Florida, New York, Illinois, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Georgia, North Carolina and Michigan. Pretty representative sample!
Beelsebooob
That's the problem - it used to be a slight imbalance - it's now a huge imbalance that allows a minority of 30% to hold power over everyone.
HypnoChanger
massive imbalance that gives one single state an amount of power beyond peer.
Beelsebooob
It wouldn't give one state an amount of power beyond peer, it would give 40 million people power that's exactly equal to their peers.
likuidlightning
This is one country. Why does it matter that a big chunk of the population live in an artificially designated area of it?
Beelsebooob
Note - it shouldn't erode faith in government - it should erode confidence in the republicans. Half the government is fighting this shit.
IdeaOfLove
Chalk one up for the neoliberals.
DangerTrain
What is it like to be this delusional?
zippydee
America's run by the corporations for the corporations. They dgaf what you think, you're just dollar signs to them
demon07
when's the next civil war happening ?
Behemoth090
Hopefully soon
KnowmSaying
Eh. 100% democracy means the world would be run by facebook articles. People are to easily misled
DataNet
That's why we have a Republic, not Democracy. Really, we can't even say idiots put these people in power. We were never given a valid choice
VinnieJonesDiary
Democracy:"a system of government in which the citizens exercise power directly or elect representatives from among themselves to form a 1/2
VinnieJonesDiary
governing body" the USA is (supposed to be) a democracy, the form of democracy it chooses is a Republic. 2/2
SirBaldrick
Meanwhile the GOP will bring in snowballs to disprove global warming.
PourquoipasWhynot
Politicians are people
Thekingofbeans
Also it's worth noting that NN was not a law. The fact that 3 people could remove it shows it was a mistake not to make it a law already.
MKUltraMega
*too
BatmanAndCradleRobin
Its far far harder to sway a hundreds of millions of people with a FB account, than 100 people with millions of dollars.
Steffn
Then they would just start putting millions into brigading and campaigning. With the hive mind of communities it's probably even cheaper
Belegatar
Swallowing spiders in your sleep?
Belegatar
No FB but it is even more impressive because of how it was done.
twozerooz
Lol. Nazis? Japanese Americans being locked up? Anti black, anti gay.. Or currently: anti free trade/protectionism, anti Muslim, anti GMO...
twozerooz
Stupidity and anti intellectualism are far more common than reason. That's why direct democracy is a bad idea
KnowmSaying
I disagree. Remember kony? All you do is make a generic ass video/article with a catchy title and people are sharing it without even readin
Steffn
Or remember Peta? The campaigning against them did work out quite well.
IdeaOfLove
He said it's harder not impossible.
KnowmSaying
And I never said it was impossible only that I disagreed with it being harder
thundercactus
Flat Earth, vaccines, homeopathic medicine.
BatmanAndCradleRobin
The GOP and anti climate change, if the Koch brothers decided those things were required the GOP would switch in 30 seconds.
Dokramuh
All of these are loud minorities.
thundercactus
Which all started out with a dozen retards, now they're in the hundreds.
Dokramuh
out of hundreds of millions.
Inimposter
Uh, maybe then ya'll should either be a democracy or don't pretend that you are???
youmoron
complete democracy is incredibly scary
Dokramuh
Disagree. It would be an accurate reflection of the people's desires. How fucked up are the people is close to how fucked up politicians are
Inimposter
Ancient Greece had complete democracy since the City States had small populations and so you legit knew a dude who should guvern.
Dokramuh
But instead of the rule of the few, it would be the rule of the many.
Thekingofbeans
Ancient Greece showed very clearly why that doesn't work.
XoxSmotpokerxoX
No, it would be rule of the loudest or rule of the trendy
EnigmaV8
Someone needs to watch The Orville episode 7.
BewilderedBeaver
Not Jarpha, though. Jarpha already knows.
ThePastmaster
How are shows I just started watching again showing up on Imgur?! Every goddamned time. Hmmm... I should watch Voyager again.
youmoron
that episode was scary.
Wormbo2
Ooh. Just finished ep.3 last night. Looking forward to the next few epidodes then!!
KnowmSaying
Already seen it! My favourite episode
aFadingMemory
Also Black Mirror S3E1 "Nosedive" and S3E6 "Hated in the Nation"
EnigmaV8
Oooooh man that’s right! Black Mirror did it first! Bryce was fantastic.
aFadingMemory
First but different. That was my favorite ep of The Orville so far.
tardis63
The entire length of Nosedive I couldn't stop thinking
deskspud
Talk to Charles Koch, to Robert Mercer, to Paul Singer----they pay a lot of money to override the "will of the voter"
TheRadarTechnicianMatt
Except this isn't a democracy, it's a republic and the framers set it up in such away where democracy has nothing to do with enacting laws.
Scrollbox
pffffffffffffffft
Ricothorton
But your not living in a democracy. Your living in a business. And man business is booming
RAGINGmediocrity
87% of statistics are made up on the spot.
cunninlinguist
That's just gone up though, now it's more
CardboardStomach
http://www.publicconsultation.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Net_Neutrality_Quaire_121217.pdf
treyryan3
I love when surveys of a little over 1000 individuals are used to represent the feelings and opinions of 326 million people.
CardboardStomach
That's kinda how surveys work.You create a smaller sample size that is comparable to the population.It's what most of statistics is based on
treyryan3
I am quite aware how surveys are conducted. I am also Aware of how statistics work. human emotional response invalidates that +\- std dev
treyryan3
According to surveys North Carolina hates homosexuals and transgenders, pornhub usage statistics tell a completely different story.
CardboardStomach
Guess this is the 13% then
imgurforants
Actually NN aside, politicians aren't supposed to blindly follow public opinion. There's supposed to be a separation between majority public
Xerxes4242
They are "supposed to" represent their constituents, not ignore them and represent the financial interests of their donors at all costs.
joyjumper
“Supposed to” itself being a matter of opinion, fundamentally it goes back to a Republic vs a Direct Democracy, eyy dems the policed parties
joyjumper
*polarized
imgurforants
opinion and implemented policy based on what's best. That's why we have elected representatives to add that buffer. Then again, this should
imgurforants
not be decided by people unelected anyway.
Belegatar
I agree that some separation should be there, but flogging for the first bribe taken and hanging for the second.
imgurforants
I agree, some founding father said democracy ends when the people realize they can vote themselves a payraise, but same goes for congress.
UncivilizedEngie
Thing is, Congress is sticking pretty hard to party lines right now and they're not making decisions based on what would be best for (1/2)
UncivilizedEngie
others, rather what will *just* keep them in office. And part of what keeps them in office is "donations" from telecoms apparently. (2/2)
ArtOzz
Thats what I said. Welcome to American, a Corporate Tyranny where corporations set the laws to enhance their profit margins.
thundercactus
Remember that time you guys complained the government was being run by corporations? Then you elected one of those wealthy businessmen...
snailphotography
Americans didn't elect Trump. Gerrymandering did.
tardis63
Well, most of us tried not to...
littlefreak3
The USA isn't a democracy. It is a republic.
BlackPengu
are you acknowledging this to make you feel better about whats happening? because either way, you get fucked too
Gator629
So many people fail to see this let alone understand why a republic is better.
XoxSmotpokerxoX
Republic where the 4 witches stand
tardis63
It's a representative democracy and a federal republic, if we need to be really specific.
untakenusername20
Democratic-republic
littlefreak3
I wrote that and then deleted it because I figured it would confuse people when they go look up what a republic is to tell me I'm wrong.
IveBeenSlackingMyWholeLife
Thanks. Also, semantics isn't an argument
GaySocialistLiberalMuslimCommieAtheist
We only use democracy as a focal point of propaganda, and common values, until it's inconvenient, then pedantic assholes come in droves.
RTKeulen
Republic does not exclude or preclude democracy
NotoriousDuchess
I believe the USA is in fact an oligarchy...
littlefreak3
Na if that was the case they wouldn't have to worry about re-elections or being sued. The scary future might take us there but not yet.
Misslnformation
Remember this FCC vote was made along party lines. Remember it's the democrats leading Congress to overturn that bullshit. Remember the
TheCriticsWereConciseItOnlyTookFourLines
…Alamo
Misslnformation
nice
CrazyGuyOnABike
Quick shoutout to Flake and Thune: two republican congressmen not afraid to stand up for their constituents.
SprungLake
21st of December
aintgottimeforbs
It was Dems who created this mess in the 1st place by pass Common Carrier Laws in 2015. This is what he while fuss is about
omh1
You are in the tiny misinformed group who think the 2015 laws were bad, or even new, same content as the 2010 rules, Title II like pre-2005
Surrenderyourkoolaid
baconandplagues
Oh hey it's that worthless shill again
Snorlax242
Please do a bit more research
adderol
You came to wrooong neighborhood....
aintgottimeforbs
Facts aren’t welcome here.
XoxSmotpokerxoX
Idiot, it was a problem before 2015
Misslnformation
MI (R) senators who want to overturn the bullshit. Remember this in 2018 when those cocksuckers who fucked you beg for your votes. Remember.
GadenKerensky
That's a risky username.
ghoststts
If you remove an s from your username, it'd be perfect .
Misslnformation
Tell me which part is false. I'll wait.
ghoststts
How did they fuck me? By doing something you don't understand or agree with? Sounds like someone fucked you into an echo chamber. You lost.
Misslnformation
Remember folks: https://www.engadget.com/amp/2017/12/14/fake-net-neutrality-comments-stolen-identities/
tardis63
"You don't understand it, here's literally no evidence supporting my claim. You LOSE!"
HypnoChanger
The 2015 Net Neutrality laws were the result of over a decade of legal battles wherein ISPs repeatedly violated Net Neutrality and while 1/
baconandplagues
No they fucked you by doing something you agree with and don't understand.
WallpaperProblems
I hope they used protection.
Thatguythatknowsbetter
Soooo you're allowed guns in case the government starts taking the piss? Well you're government's been fucking chaos.... Jus saying
Thneitis
I’ve actually heard people bring this up in a kinda scary way
Falos
Court's first. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_boxes_of_liberty
RedWingedBlackbirds
Hadn’t seen that before- thank you kind Falos
ghsdkgb
Problem is, the people who bathe in the 2nd amendment are the ones who think the government's been doing just fine
Dingus2
Actually, the problem is you, and the people like you, who - when they see everyone in the fucking country agree - work to make it partisan.
Gator629
You are wrong! Many 2A people are naturally suspicious of power. There is nothing more 'American' than a healthy distrust of authority.
imanatheistdebateme
I'm one of those. The 2nd is important because things change over time. Our government may not always be relatively benign.
spiffynidd
Washington state has already started the states rights movement. SC tried that, ended poorly.
MrTay
Yeah the difference is wa has a lot of power as a state. It’s independently wealthy without gov aid. Home to a lot of our corporations.
MoreCowBellBaby
Well, typically those voting in favor of NN also vote against guns. Typically.
DecapitatedJizzWizard
Pretty much everyone votes in favor of NN. Idiots like you are what keep these fucking party lines healthy.
MoreCowBellBaby
Well this idiot crossed party lines and called his reps, asshole. The Republicans are pro-gun, anti-NN, opposite for Democrats, that's it
Thatguythatknowsbetter
*your- excuse me
Cobrajet500
You know better.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Thatguythatknowsbetter
Well you are government is not what I meant to say.
ZanarkandAbes
Thatguythatknowsbetter
Dumbass
OptimusPantry
Yes you're absolutely right, gun violence is definitely the appropriate response to a policy you don't like
DecapitatedJizzWizard
Worked in the 1700s
ChrisTallant
That’s the problem: the people with all the guns love the government since they let them have more guns.
Belegatar
Nobody "lets" me have guns. And if they want mine they better be ready for a fight.
MatrimBloodyCauthon
You've got an illusion of power, there. If the government wanted your guns, they'd take them. It's just easier to leave you alone.
Belegatar
An illusion of power? I will fight to the death for my rights and I will fight against anyone who attempts to remove those rights.
MatrimBloodyCauthon
It would be a quick death. Like, 5 seconds. All they need is a drone shooting at you from a clear blue sky.
MatrimBloodyCauthon
I'm just saying, the time to fight back for your rights is now, not in an imaginary future raid.
LizardEnterprises
The second-amendment nuts only rebel against the government when the president is Black. Go ahead. Prove me wrong.
MastahPetah
I'm for the 2nd amendment. I'm a lot more uneasy now than I ever was under Obama.
LizardEnterprises
Yeah, but I'm betting you didn't rebel against the government either time. Obama had at least two armed rebellions.
Dingus2
Okay, here's your proof: 100% of black presidents have not been subject to a second-amendment nut rebellion.
LizardEnterprises
Actually that's false. 100% of Black Presidents have faced at least two armed rebellions
LizardEnterprises
2) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupation_of_the_Malheur_National_Wildlife_Refuge
LizardEnterprises
1) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundy_standoff
Dingus2
Note that it's called the "Bundy Rebellion" there. Tell me, was Waco a rebellion?
LizardEnterprises
1/2 Possibly. If you bring out an armed militia to resist that government, and do not disperse when ordered to, that is a rebellion.
LizardEnterprises
2/2 With Waco, its debatable if they had the opportunity to leave or were just killed in a poorly executed warrant, but bundy CHOSE to stay.
DrinkBootySweat
Not enough to warrant gun owners to start a rebellion. Losing net neutrality isn't enough for someone to risk their life over
DrinkBootySweat
By repealing it. Makes us other gun owning republicans look bad. Worse than bad. Like fucking psychos (3
Ivegotsomethinginmyfrontpocketforyou
I disagree. But to me it wasn't about net neutrality, it was about losing freedom, a corporate shill controls the organization that 1/2
Ivegotsomethinginmyfrontpocketforyou
controls what we see and hear in media. Our President is a racist, lying, backstabber. It's so much more than just internet speeds. 2/2
DecapitatedJizzWizard
Oh man lets now forget how they literally fucking LAUGHED AND MOCKED us as they robbed us of it.
[deleted]
[deleted]
[deleted]
[deleted]
Belegatar
I have my personal boundaries that if crossed will force my hand, but there are still non violent ways to fix this. But I swore an oath 1/
Belegatar
And I will keep that oath no matter who is in charge or what the public thinks.
CoBr2
As long as that power is on THEIR side they love it.
Ravben
The first time it was over a tax.....
throughthoughtthough
This
StarPal
Boston Tea Party?
Ravben
And that was over a tax.... I lost count of all the reasons we have by this point.
bushidopirate
Time to dump all of the Comcast rental modems into the harbor!
DrinkBootySweat
Also, most gun owners were in favor of the repeal because they only identify as Republican and they believe it's a Republican's move (2
Thatguythatknowsbetter
I kinda meant everything on top of that. As well as the looming loss of democracy that the well outdated constitution was made to defend.
MrShoez
I feel like this is incorrect.
DrinkBootySweat
I thought that too but talking with other gun guys on forums they were all for repealing it. I was shocked
FireflySky
I've noticed this to. What I gather is A. towing party line and B. think protecting freedoms of corporations = protecting personal freedom
Belegatar
Fuck this party shit. That is one big reason we are in the condition we are in.
DrinkBootySweat
I know. I feel the same way
JustHereForTheRiots
DeathGear
I 100% agree to that. Honestly we need to reshape our government. It's living in the past and is not made for this current time. 1/2
DeathGear
I just don't know what type of government would be the best. Something new and different for sure. 2/2
Spaid47Trey57
Octopoutine
And the government has tanks and drones. To loosely quote jim jefferies- if we all had fucking muskets I'd fight the government
youmoron
yea lets take our political cues from comedians.
MoreCowBellBaby
Homeboy, numb nuts in the middle of the desert have been running circles around us for how many decades now? Pisses, armed Americans 1/2
MoreCowBellBaby
2/2 would do plenty fine, believe me.
insanumingenium
Funny US rebelled and the rebels had as good (and better) weapons, but now it is argued that civilians don't need military grade weapons.
DY427
The US populace is under strict surveillance andany rebellion would be doomed. I️t could never organize; its leaders would have “accidents”
LoudBirb
People CAN own military-grade weapons. They just need a class 3 licence. But, considering the multi-million $ cost of modern stuff...
LoudBirb
They can't afford it. Tech's advanced to the point where a decentralized force stands very little chance of winning.
insanumingenium
There are whole classes of weapons that are forbidden regardless of license. Never mind that licensing still stinks of infringement to me.
insanumingenium
But I was referring to the common pro control argument that only “sporting” weapons should be permitted.
smellyboots
Anyone got a source for that 80%? Curious.
Skyluin
Honestly it may be more, a lot of those for it have been bots
SnxLorde
http://www.publicconsultation.org/united-states/overwhelming-bipartisan-majority-opposes-repealing-net-neutrality/ Uni of Maryland
apcamanda
*Triggered*
mistermichigan
Yes, all 330 million Americans were polled as to whether ISPs should be regulated under Title I or Title II of the Communcations Act.
Pazuzu4All
I don’t think you know how polls work.
TheGirlInTheFireplace
I don't know if you're joking or not because I was polled so...
angelwkw3
There's a ton of polls where at the bare minimum is 60%+ in support of it, but most are above 75%.
AcidOPhilus
Isn't the figure for gun control even higher and that shit hasn't changed in decades?
saltandsunshine
Thats because big cities make up most of the population, and guns + cities dont mix well.
UncivilizedEngie
We are more unified on Net Neutrality than we are on who should have been president.
Zademan
Ask anyone aware of net neutrality’s death if they want it
americanjetset
I'm aware of it and frankly don't have a strong opinion on the matter. *Shrug*
MultipleMorgasms
are you, perhaps, a rich cunt?
americanjetset
I do okay.
SendMePicturesOfYourDog
I know someone that says we don't need it, but won't let me explain why he's wrong
AttackOfTheSpaceBat
http://www.publicconsultation.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Net_Neutrality_Quaire_121217.pdf
G11marksman
I'm 100% in support of NN, but from what I remember of basic HS stats that seems like some *really* heavy bias on the second argument.
Thneitis
1000 people
Flawrence
Sample size 1070... GG
DarkZalgo
Yeah that's only about 35x larger than the minimum it needs to be to mean anything.
MrAppendixX
Saucy dooot
smellyboots
Much obliged.
Somethingdeepncomedic
I think people should be against obolishing Net Nuetrality but those are some lopsided questions...are you in favor of letting ISP's steal?
AttackOfTheSpaceBat
It's an argument. You can say your opinion or your stated belief in an argument. It's not supposed to be a factually based. Also both >
AttackOfTheSpaceBat
Sides are presented with the favoring stating that NN is stifling innovation and making internet access more expensive.
TheWoodpeckerSighed
Agreed, bias questions for sure.
NeverTooSoon
There are three kinds of lies; Lies, damned lies, and statistics. Biased data collection is what enables Texas Sharpshooting.
Thneitis
1000 people
AttackOfTheSpaceBat
Not sure if that's a lot or too few
AttackOfTheSpaceBat
I mean it was only taken over two days
Thneitis
Too few. In a nation of 330,000,000 1000 is a puny sample size
bigusdigus
That's some man made global warming extrapolations right there. Its crazy that people believe its actually 80% in favor of NN
baconandplagues
Given the fact that climate change is indeed caused mostly by man, and that few people support repeal. It's accurate.
bigusdigus
Have you studied for yourself or are you trusting Al Gore propaganda? Because there's still lots of debate as to how little humans effect is
Evi1Gav
If properly sampled, that's about three times more than required for statistical purposes.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Evi1Gav
That's why I said properly sampled.
NERDRAGEohacat
Depends on what kind of margin of error and confidence level you want. 1068 is minimum for 95% confidence and 3% margin of error.
DarkZalgo
Three times more? Nah statistically only 30 is needed for a normal distribution. A bit high of a margin of error maybe though.
Evi1Gav
Statistically it's around 300 when discussing people's opinions.
Buzzdog1
http://www.lmfgtfy.com/?q=percentage+of+americans+against+net+neutrality
2and900
Google isn't a source, you dumb fuck.
Joshisorderingnow
2and900
Ya I totally missed "such a funny joke", it was "soo funny", it was a shit joke.
Joshisorderingnow
Buzzdog1
No shit tinkerbell. It is, however, used to find sources. But I guess your middle school dropout education wouldn't have taught you that.
ICOPPEDTHISHOUSE
Ouch
2and900
He didn't ask how to find sources, you linked fuck all and thought it was sooo funny, go back to sucking your mom's tit.
JamesGiraffePoster
TheAdventuresofStealy
Does he think Republicans care about eroding faith in government? That's precisely what they're trying to do.
TheGame21x
Mmhmm. They campaign on the premise that big government doesn't work, get elected, go to DC, do everything they can to ensure the
TheGame21x
government doesn't work, and then go back to their constituents saying "See? I told you big government doesn't work! Re-elect me!"
NomadicPaladin
The true conservative perspective is putting faith in your own ability to accomplish something, not government. So in a way you are right...
NomadicPaladin
...but it would be wrong to believe that undercutting government ability is akin to destroying trust in institutional government. I...
NomadicPaladin
...personally support net neutrality as a major contributor to market competition, but the argument could be made that polling is...
NomadicPaladin
...irrelevant until election day. They are elected to the public trust with the expectation that they will do what is best for them, and...
NomadicPaladin
...have the allotted term time to accomplish that goal. Are there failures, absolutely. Does it need improvement, absolutely. Should we as..
TheAdventuresofStealy
I'm talking about the kleptocrats of the modern Republican party, and people like Bannon who make no secret they just want to blow it all up
TheAdventuresofStealy
Are you suggesting the Republican party as it is today is comprised of and represents true conservativism? That'd be pretty damning.
NomadicPaladin
Not at all. The populism that is kicking up is a symptom of situation and not a truly conservative ideal. For example, free trade is...
NomadicPaladin
...argued to be a Democrat ideal, but it promotes global competition and demands the best from competitors. Saying build American, while...
RorfVonBun
You know why the second ammendment was enacted. I think its time you guys in the states uphold that right...
chiefs86
Pro-tip: The people who don't want Net Neutrality are *also* the ones who have a vast majority of the guns.
idowhatiwantwastaken
Not enacted for people crying on the internet. Just saying.
vowofloudness
Good call, I'm gonna go join my state's militia.
joeyjojosharknado
I was just thinking the other day how the US doesn't have enough gun-wielding anti establishment types.
GaySocialistLiberalMuslimCommieAtheist
Thing is a huge amount are anti NN. They are sorta the type who don't know how deal life works and only care about fantasy.
thundercactus
It was idealized in a time when a bunch of organized farmers with muskets could (and did many times) overtake local governments....
RorfVonBun
Be hell of a quick show though. ;)
thundercactus
I don't think the founding fathers envisioned farmers with semi-automatic rifles to face off against tanks, aircraft, and drones.
RorfVonBun
Also, who do you think mans those guns, tanks and drones. People... hate to see what would happen if they were turned around. Would be chaos
thundercactus
I believe Syria recently tried something to that nature...
tardis63
People, who report to their superiors and follow orders. It's human nature. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment
RorfVonBun
That being said, what if it's the suprriors whom decide. Welp I've had it. Time to tell my superiors to get stuffed.
RorfVonBun
Could be there superiors rely on them to do alot of the thinking, then boom. You have collapse in chain of commad. This being in ideal scene
Sionas
I'm just saying, but the will of the people isn't always rational. In this case it is, but beware of appealing to popular opinion.
SnickerMyKnickers
Truth but this was one of those times when we should have been listened to
Andied
You are so very right on so many levels. However, democracy it is not.
Higure
Look at treatment of indigenous people across the world throughout history. A good democracy protects its minorities.
JoeT85
you are quite correct that the will isn't always 'sharp', but that's what the Senate & House are for, to listen and slow down. 1/2
JoeT85
Sadly, mostly due to delegation and neglect, we've allowed unaccountable people in to positions of power. Presidents included.
ILostMyNameHelp
That does not matter. If the majority of the population want or don’t want something done, no matter how stupid the government must comply.
applesforjuice
In this case it is, but only because everyone misunderstands net neutrality. In a good way, but they don't know 5
2SpooookyCrisps
Yea it's called tyranny of the majority. Agree with your point.
Theoryofrelevantivity
America was founded by the people, for the people, and of the people. "the people" aren't making the decisions anymore. It's unAmerican.
jadspop
True. America isn't always rational. Then again that's what we fought for. To represent us. If we fall for being stupid its our fault.
notreallyamorningperson
Isn’t government supposed to be a proportional representation of the community and their needs though? Surely 80% majority means something?
DoctorWh0m
I like you for agreeing with a conclusion but still rejecting the stated premise.
Sesquey
It got Trumpet voted in! o. woo.
NERDRAGEohacat
There's a reason why populism is debated as a feature or flaw of democracy.
WeGotCompanyCaptain
I would argue partially rational And some very xulrish
HinmnIsNotMyName
WeNowGoToDanWithTheWeather
https://youtu.be/d7lxwFEB6FI
YellingJerk
Worked for Australia and Gay Marriage. We took an optional vote, Parliament approved with the will of the people.
IAlwaysPost140Characters
Tyranny of the majority is a legitimate concern and should definitely be guarded against. But we have courts and elected officials for that.
MOTHERFUCKINGALLAH
I think they call that 'Tyrrany of the majority '
BatmanRidingANarwhal
Which is why the government still "makes the decisions" but they stopped listening to the public at all long ago
EternalSunshineofthePotlessMind
I personally believe the US gov stopped listening to the will of (some of) the people around the Vietnam War. Maybe 1 or 2 presidents before
thundercactus
Right around the time the cold war started. "Fuck what people think, we need to stop communism, because REASONS"
ManThatLaughs
et tu brute?
wrxagon
Majority should always rule as long as it doesn't interfere with inalienable rights.
TheGuyWhoStoppedLurking
That's not the point mate
Sooderfed
Mob mentality is a dangerous thing.
derpaderps
"Start with the assumption / that a million people are smart / smarter than one" (whammy bar)
Noughmad
Unfortunately, will of the people is the best thing we have. Yes, something like a benevolent dictatorship could be better, but it never is.
Grandmastersexy
20% of people believe in alien abductions. We need checks and balances on mob stupidity.
Lurch1911
That’s true, sometimes what the people want is wrong, but the government serves at the will of the people regardless
grammarfairy
that's fair. But if your explicit job is to represent the will of your constituents, you need to.
FishyMcFishFace
Exactly. If it were all up to majority rule, gays would have been murdered during the aids crisis in the 80s
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
Unpopular opinion puffin here, but that should not matter. A democracy is representative of the will of the people, good, bad or ugly.
ThisIsTheBestICanDo
Yeah wasn't it the will of the people to elect Trump...
cptbahab
Actually no. Popular vote was in Hillary's favor. By a lot. Granted she's not that great of a choice either.
theFinks
True, I’m sure 90% of people would not like to pay taxes but it’s necessary. Not saying NN is but I agree with the sentiment.
wrxagon
Taxes aren't as necessary when you start stripping down government. Government acts like a hungry corporation and requires more food/money
FreeMurmurSounds
Brexit...
cheekypocketwank
It disgusts me, but Brexit is not going to change anything because of the constant bitching by the remainers. Brussels will rule forever.
HenricEk
I hope it goes through, so the EU cancels all it’s traderoutes etc with England and repeals every single beneficial law the EU stands for 1/
HenricEk
So that you also can experience not having someone to control your country not going down the drain, hello USA. And ultimately having /2
HenricEk
Every single international company created by the brits moving out of England because its not economically acceptable by the board to /3
cheekypocketwank
Their lack of optimism and faith in the uk is what will hold us back from ever being a success.
SudoNimm
Doesn't matter. Will of the people should trump all. Wait, poor choice of words there...
Leegionnaire
For proof, research the Tennessee football head coach hiring fiasco. A disaster within a failure inside a used diaper.
Riperoni
*cough* Donald trump *cough* brexit *cough*
UncivilizedEngie
I hope you get that cold looked at. In the mean time be aware that the people didn't want Trump. The Electoral college did. Britain (1/2)
UncivilizedEngie
also has issues with certain parties getting a disproportionate amount of power, so in both cases the majority was actually right (2/2)
PhysicistInHiding
Hence why we're a republic, not a true democracy.
AndrewDickie
The will of the people got Trump elected.
CaldariBob
The will of the people in the Electoral College, you mean.
Clockwork0813
Listening to the majority vote is literally the whole point. Eliminating the middlemen between elected offices would defeat voter apathy.
ZanarkandAbes
The petition to force the US Government to build a Death Star comes to mind.
ILiekToCookAndBake
Reagan started it.
Xenas
Star Wars project
cptbahab
While a funny joke, it was a petition for the US gov. to respond to that request. The response was: no, it's too expensive and impractical.
WeNowGoToDanWithTheWeather
...is it 14 billion dollars expensive? Bernies plan was somewhere in that area right? Define expensive.
cptbahab
https://techcrunch.com/2013/01/11/white-house-responds-to-death-star-petition-obama-does-not-support-blowing-up-planets/
WeNowGoToDanWithTheWeather
...that might send us slightly into debt.
airandfingers
TL;DR: $850 quadrillion
worldsGreatestDetectiveOne
That is a legitimate goal. Who needs nuclear weapons when you can just blow up everyone with one efficient laser beam. Go Green people.
BlondieSayWhat
PiccoloRick
LordFenris
I mean they're not wrong.
HEROofTIMEandSPACE
Example: 100% of people would live more comfortably if they had a 0% tax rate.
UncivilizedEngie
not really. Idk about you, but I'm really happy about a lot of the services the government provides. Like roads.
HEROofTIMEandSPACE
I agree. When thinking rationally the mob should all understand that taxes are important, but most people vote with selfish intentions.
CotterPyke
well dont worry, this current bunch of nabobs is in no danger of that
caelxs
If we followed popular opinion Trump wouldn't be prez
sfcorax
But, that is what a democracy is all about. If the people are dumb and the Government disobeys isn't that than not a democracy?
ButchMcKenzie
We're a republic
sfcorax
I thought you guys were a democracy? What's the difference?
ButchMcKenzie
Idk why you were downvoted. I was wrong. We are a democratic republic or representative democracy. Not pure democracy.
sfcorax
So that still means the government should listen to the people unless it is a stupid ass decision?
HowDoYouChangeThis
80% of America wants free porn
glenlochie
if you're starting a revolution remember to kill the rich guys first. After that there won't be any need to fight
micotyro
Very true
davepermen
as a swiss... works just fine over here.. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ (checks healthcare, public roads and transport, etc... ya, just fine)
perrosevero
yeah you guys are on a roll :D
STGxDante
Rational or not the majority should rule.
MegaDragon
Brexit anyone?
wrxagon
Good example for public awareness of consequences. Live and learn and guess
OrangeLeft
We demand whales! Ban crabs!
VirginSurgeon
Nazis had the popular vote
StellarJay77
StarPal
haroldstickyhand
Aaaand there it is. Classic nazi/ literally hitler argument
AzothTheGuildRat
Thekingofbeans
No they didn't. They burned down the Reichstag, blamed their main rival, communists, and seized emergency powers.
ImProbablyJoking
They had the popular vote because they were hurting bad by WWI and the Nazis promised a better life for the people and they ate it up.
Thekingofbeans
They didn't have the popular vote, Germany had largely recovered from WW1. The Great Depression is what made the Nazis a mainstream party.
thundercactus
They lost the election. Hitler was *appointed* chancellor, and President Hindenburg was actually opposed to the idea.
MetroidJunkie
This is why we have a Republic, representatives on our behalf. Pure Democracies are deadly.
Studoku
Representative democracy is only a little better.
MetroidJunkie
For the record, pure Democracies are mob rule and the minority is screwed over. You want that?
Sionas
Hell no, unfortunately many of our representatives seem to be easily bribed.
StellarJay77
Then we need to take away the ability of those with money to use it to influence decisions, we’re just giving them a way to incr. their vote
MetroidJunkie
That wouldn't be happening if the voters weren't falling asleep at the wheel and allowing themselves to be manipulated.
lawideas
This. Remember when the will of the people was overwhelmingly in favor of interring the Japanese?
Lord0Trade
To be fair, the Canadians did it in 1939.
dafawkudoin
Well we did win WW2
darkdragonempress
The way America was supposed to be majority rules with minority rights. So the will of the majority is important, but it isn't supposed 1
darkdragonempress
To be enough to ever take the rights of people away. 2
StellarJay77
What about their right to own slaves that was taken away? Just sayin.
cptbahab
There's not enough comment here for me to tell you how ridiculous that argument is. Assuming you're not just trolling.
Stegaosaurus
So what makes you think you have the right to take away ISPs' rights to milk every cent out of you? Corporations are people too, you know!
TargaryenLoyalist
In today’s America, corporations are “people” with more rights than actual human beings.
dafawkudoin
Somebody paid attention in political science..
[deleted]
[deleted]
StarPal
2444666668888888101010101010101010
Lmao
ChainmailleAddict
Don't know why you're being downvoted. Oh wait, yes I do.
thundercactus
Right. They could have saved tens of lives. Perhaps even dozens!
Sionas
Yikes.
AawesomeAardvaark
Fuck you, troll
InfamousGerbil
The will of the people should always be followed to the extent that it doesn’t infringe people’s rights. There we go.
CaldariBob
But in context, these were the same people who, at the time, wouldn't drink out of the colored fountain.
HowComeDespiteTheFact
Party beause of social constructs fabricated by the government to keep the public separate to swing their ideas around more easily.
TheGreatAndPowerfulSage
...Which was probably a good idea at the time.
thundercactus
Given the culture of the Japanese at the time, there was at least SOME merit to the plan. Despite being morally wrong.
RoseTheSpecialEdTeacher
The most highly decorated WW2 group was the 442nd, comprised entirely of Japanese Americans.
leodavinci1
Tell that to George Takai.
OneNeoEon
i have wondered how many interred survived that would have perished in the angry mobs that were popular back then. 1/
OneNeoEon
not saying internment was right but they were still lynching blacks for this and that back then. /2
viciousviking
This is the reason why we have a representative style of democracy
leodavinci1
It's called a Republic... and it's not a democracy. Look at how good democracy was for the ancient Greeks. Oh wait... they had slaves.
cklepper
We don't have democracy at all. We have a constitutional republic.
Ragswolf
A republic is a form of democracy
dafawkudoin
Like the People’s Democratic Republic of Korea or China?
tehwilsonator
A constitutional republic is a type of representative democracy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representative_democracy
imgurmohr
aka democratic republic
IdeaOfLove
Which would be great, if we actually had representatives.
namiasdf
Except your representatives can be bought.
feeltheice
Anyone can be bought.
CaldariBob
Agreed. Exhibit 1? Your mom.
namiasdf
Yes, but it is no excuse for the terrible shape the American democracy is in.
feeltheice
Not a democracy. And really americans are lazy. We bitch about political spending but spend more on Halloween than we do on elections
OffendedSkeleton
That’s how we got Brexit. Direct democracy is dangerous due to mob mentality and the ease with which people can be swayed.
haroldstickyhand
No, the eu is trash that’s why
CheshireAlice
EU has nn laws... so its trash but we have the best broadband. And healthcare and cheep flights and no school shootings...
dcyborg
No just mass terror attacks and rape
CheshireAlice
Not where I live. None of that either
leodavinci1
Which doesn't inherently make them wrong. The elites (of any political stripe) never think they're wrong.
dogton
It's rather the use of popular opinion and unhappiness that's been at work.
AxolotlInATopHat
And that people in general are idiots who don’t research, learn how things work, and think it through before voicing their opinions.
StellarJay77
Critical thinking is not a part of the standard curriculum of education. Imagine how hard it would be to control the masses if it were.
tehwilsonator
The nativism behind Brexit is shit, but economically, those people kind of have a point
rollipukki
As Brits are at the moment realizing, all the economic advances that sold the Brexit were lies. Vote now would be 55-45 to stay.
tehwilsonator
In the short term, they are lies (and, again, the nativist part is shit). But protectionism is better in the long term for economies than>>
tehwilsonator
<
tehwilsonator
Removing sovereignty over monetary policy means policies that benefit financial services and established industrial countries. Who gets >>
tehwilsonator
<< shafted? Every city in the UK that isn't London.
JayEnfield
Economist here. Virtually EVERY economist I know and peer-reviewed study I've found forecasts economic loss as a result of instability.
tehwilsonator
Yes, fighting for sovereignty against market forces designed to entrench broader EU interest will do that.
tehwilsonator
But what does that mean for the UK? An even broader percentage of GDP coming from financial services? Does that sound great for non-London?
JayEnfield
And UK gov is doing their DAMNEDEST to make the process as volatile and unpredictable as possible.
tehwilsonator
Brussels is also doing its part. Both the EU and the UK government have every reason to make Brexit as painful as it can be, to serve as >>
JayEnfield
Personally, I /really/ don't think that such a massive change ought to have been jumped into on a 51/49 poll.
IdeaOfLove
What about how easily money sways our representatives?
notmyimgurian
much easier to sway people when there's less people that you need to sway
OffendedSkeleton
Also a problem but a distinct one
IdeaOfLove
Just saying, if it's between letting money or people rule, I'd go with people - at least then we're responsible instead of profit margins.
twozerooz
That's why the only job of the people is to elect good representatives. And we can't even do that right.
IdeaOfLove
We'd do a lot better if we were given real choices...
twozerooz
You were. Then you elected Trump. Because emails and Facebook posts saying Hillary killed people. Spooky.