I never really knew much about her other than she was pretty hated by a lot of conservative men. Then I learned what she stood for and I understood why. She really was way ahead of her time.
The whole "Hanoi Jane" thing was blown entirely out of proportion. She wasn't a communist, just against the futility of an unwinnable, shitty war. She probably could have chosen a better way to express that, but there it is.
Jane Fonda was played by the North Vietnamese because as a young and naive person she was way out of her element. Her actions were stupid, but then who isn’t stupid at that time of life. I don’t hold her mistakes, which she has admitted to, against her
Some peole just don't remember the bombing campaigns Vietnam conducted over US cities during the war, the raids conducted illegally over the border from Canada, the terrorising of farm towns in Iowa, the chemical weapons they sprayed over California which devastated the land for decades and the malformed American "Orange" babies born from the still-contaminated milk. These events may as well be considered fiction by today's generation. Our boys fought the enemy and won, never forget.
She was 10-15 years older than me when she began taking a war stance and standing up for women and staring an exercise cult. For a young girl, she was simply marvelous as a role model for the future.
Oh no, she spoke out against a dumb war. How horribly unpatriotic that she didn't want our guys risking their lives to bomb non-military targets. /sarcasm
Trump is a greasy, sticky, orange turd. I hope he spends the test of his shitty life "truthing" from prison that he was innocent the whole time until he finally checks that nobody is listening anymore and he hangs himself in his cell. Also, as I understand, Jane fonda is a turd who also needs flushing. Her approval of women's rights is the clock being right twice a day.l.
When I was in school in the 90s it was taught to default to male gendered pronouns and not “they/them” unless plurality was uncertain. If it was a singular, it was he/him if unknown. At least my dumbass catholic school in Florida taught that.
That is how the Hebrew language works as a rule. So when they call God "he" they may be saying god is masculine, but in the original Hebrew, it is just as fair to interpret it as "gender unknown"
Watch The Vietnam War by Burns & Novick. She wasn’t speaking out she was in North Vietnam with the soldiers that were killing Americans. She is at best a traitor to her piers. Fuck MAGA Fuck Conservatives this is just an informed American speaking
She was hated by the "greatest generation" who called her a commie, a traitor, and worse when of course she was merely an American freely speaking her mind and usually on the right side of history.
Quick wikipedia search: "When stories of torture of returning POWs were later being publicized by the Nixon administration, Fonda said that those making such claims were "hypocrites and liars and pawns", adding about the prisoners she visited, "These were not men who had been tortured. These were not men who had been starved. These were not men who had been brainwashed."" Seems like she believed whatever the NVA told her
Gee, sounds about as naive and gullible as the Americans who supported the war believing there was "light at the end of the tunnel" and if we didn't win the rest of Asia would "fall like dominoes".
She's a boomer, so don't generalize. Vietnam vets are just a boomer subset. Hippies, anti-war protestors, and the first openly gay rights activists were all boomers.
Weren't there similar subsets in the Greatest Generation as well, including hipsters, anti-war-protestors as well as openly gay rights activists? Surely, and entire generation didn't hate her.
The Greatest Generation had Beatniks (the Beats), some "hipsters" (Ray and Charles Eames), and some forward Civil Rights thinkers (MLK, the "Rat Pack"), but the "red scare" of the 40s and early 50s drove progressives underground and the vast majority of the GG were solidly conservative. The explosion of "youth culture", civil rights, and Vietnam changed everything. 1968-72 were an era of radical forment in the US.
Of course, "conservative" could actually mean they were conservative back then. Today, "conservative" means everything from fascist, to Christian nationalist, to accelerationist. Actual conservatives are the center-right-Democrats now.
It's important to understand that while there are parallels, what appear to be right and left divides in the 1940's, 50's and 60's were driven largely by WWII. That was such a monumental effort, and required such unity and sacrifice, that to hear any anti-military or anti-war talk was to them a visceral repudiation of everything they sacrificed so much for - including democracy. For the GG, the military is what preserved democracy. For boomers, they were taught to stand up for what was right.-
The Vietnam War was not at all like WWII. It wasn't even a declared war. And for the first time, people were seeing that war televised every night when they came home from work. Young men were being drafted before they could vote to go get ground into hamburger - for what? What good is democracy if you aren't free to exercise the rights ensured to you by the Constitution? We sacrificed everything for a free future, and the kids today are spitting on that sacrifice? WTF? so - conflict. -
There's a vast difference between speaking out against a war and visiting the enemy, posing with their anti-aircraft guns. If you lose someone close to you in a conflict, then anyone seen as giving "aid and comfort" to the enemy will be reviled. You may not like how older folks feel about her, but they are absolutely entitled to their opinions.
I went through SERE and receive classified briefings on the Vietnam POWS. She caused real damage to those in captivity. Those soldiers didn’t want to be part of the war either.
I am "older folks", and I am also entitled to my opinion. It was an unjust war that the US should never have become engaged in. It was a civil war, not a "domino" driven Communist expansion. It was waste of US treasure, and most importantly, young lives. You can hate on Fonda for giving "aid and comfort", but save some for the US governmdnt that destroyed 50,000 Americans' and millions of Vietnamese lives, and changed nothing.
The thing to remember is this was a fear reaction to “communist” countries that the far right used to start a war, persecute people who had different opinions, & make a ton of money(rich people with investments in manufacturing, developing & selling weapons & supporting military action) from governments and mercenaries. They are doing this now. If we don’t rein in big business and make them play nice with everyone, we will be in WWIII. Because everyone knows that wars are great for the economy
And economies around the world are stagnating from inflation caused by big business price gouging everyone and buying politicians to look away. The corporations are financing fascists fringe groups to stir up people who are finding it harder to make ends meet and steering them to blame immigrants and others as the problem when all that is needed is to tax the corporations and dismantle the monopolies.
Well I get that but how many innocents were raped and murdered. That war is full of horrible events, both sides. Again we shouldn't have been there, we just followed in after other countries. Young men were drafted, the poor went and rich didn't. And the end wasn't a proud one in our history. As a young teenager I saw the war on TV every day after school. I will never forget watching US forces blowing up a bridge with women and children, old farmers with livestock, a proud moment per news.
And my older sister got a pen pal from news paper ad to support the troops. He sent her Polaroids of his boots on top of mangled bodies of enemy. Were they really? Why bragging enough to stand on a pile of bodies? She burned them, she was 16.
GasBandit
The old story about her betraying POWs was falsified https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/jane-fonda-pows/
InTheDistanceAPlaintiveEnglishHorn
wow that hair in the first clip!
marka1967
Not Fonda Jane. Traitor bitch. With any luck she will get cervical cancer.
Dudeitsonlyme
Yep many remember her as Hanoi Jane. But I like to remember her as “ Barbarella”. 😆
n0n53n53
I never really knew much about her other than she was pretty hated by a lot of conservative men. Then I learned what she stood for and I understood why. She really was way ahead of her time.
AyatollahBahloni
The whole "Hanoi Jane" thing was blown entirely out of proportion. She wasn't a communist, just against the futility of an unwinnable, shitty war. She probably could have chosen a better way to express that, but there it is.
Ugavemecocacola1960
She's an amazing Brilliant woman. Fuckin love this.
Polyyphemos
Jane Fonda was played by the North Vietnamese because as a young and naive person she was way out of her element. Her actions were stupid, but then who isn’t stupid at that time of life. I don’t hold her mistakes, which she has admitted to, against her
EmperorShaddam
Some peole just don't remember the bombing campaigns Vietnam conducted over US cities during the war, the raids conducted illegally over the border from Canada, the terrorising of farm towns in Iowa, the chemical weapons they sprayed over California which devastated the land for decades and the malformed American "Orange" babies born from the still-contaminated milk. These events may as well be considered fiction by today's generation. Our boys fought the enemy and won, never forget.
sadbitterkitten
She was 10-15 years older than me when she began taking a war stance and standing up for women and staring an exercise cult. For a young girl, she was simply marvelous as a role model for the future.
MrKomisiripala
She walked the walk & has been consistent throughout her life in terms of advocating for justice for all
Aimoss
Love her!
arkaboop
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZ9GSFZZY6c
Samantha4u
Never heard about this lady before.
labtob
love the hairmet
netutoring
Oh no, she spoke out against a dumb war. How horribly unpatriotic that she didn't want our guys risking their lives to bomb non-military targets. /sarcasm
azazyel
She's still being arrested!
bigby4sheriff
Because she can afford bail!
GiantFlyingLabia
The legacy of the people who hated Jane is alive and well in those who are voting for Trump
Makerofroads
Trump is a greasy, sticky, orange turd. I hope he spends the test of his shitty life "truthing" from prison that he was innocent the whole time until he finally checks that nobody is listening anymore and he hangs himself in his cell. Also, as I understand, Jane fonda is a turd who also needs flushing. Her approval of women's rights is the clock being right twice a day.l.
THISISYELLING
Yet the conservatives of the country vilified her for speaking out each and every time.
SeenItDoneIt
While true, many liberals at the time felt she went too far as well.
THISISYELLING
Many liberals voted for the patriot act too. Many supported the war in Iraq. Who lead the charge in both instances?
dorenavant
The legendary Jane Fonda.
SeenItDoneIt
*infamous
ongabonga
ongabonga
You downvote me for sending a heart. Who does that, shame on you miserable shits.
JustLikeSoManyCups
I have such disappointment that the women naturally gendered the professor as a guy in a question about the legacy of feminism
TheobromineAddict
One woman.
angpanange365
Amen
NotSinceTheAccidend
When I was in school in the 90s it was taught to default to male gendered pronouns and not “they/them” unless plurality was uncertain. If it was a singular, it was he/him if unknown. At least my dumbass catholic school in Florida taught that.
IrrelevantHandle
Well, it was taught that way in rural Canada in the aughts, too.
ArcaneM37
That is how the Hebrew language works as a rule. So when they call God "he" they may be saying god is masculine, but in the original Hebrew, it is just as fair to interpret it as "gender unknown"
bigby4sheriff
Watch The Vietnam War by Burns & Novick. She wasn’t speaking out she was in North Vietnam with the soldiers that were killing Americans. She is at best a traitor to her piers. Fuck MAGA Fuck Conservatives this is just an informed American speaking
zagibu
And? Those Americans were just simple invaders. Should she be on the wrong side just because of country allegiance?
MissSiesta
She's not a saint 🤷♀️
thereitis101
*peers*
Atlasraven
*peers
bigby4sheriff
Hold my peers
EternallyIgnorant
If a russian celebrity was with Ukrainian soldiers, or a Isreali celebrity was with Palestinian soldiers, how would you feel?
Atlasraven
I can answer that with Steven Seagal. What a useful idiot. Fucking stay overseas.
EternallyIgnorant
Steven Seagal is in Russia. Thats not at all an answer to what I asked though. Seagal is american (i think) we are invading Russia.
glovelyday
She was hated by the "greatest generation" who called her a commie, a traitor, and worse when of course she was merely an American freely speaking her mind and usually on the right side of history.
JohnnyLawlessEsq
She generally was, but the Vietnam thing was ehhhhhh...
40ozking
The military still hate her they don't remember why but they can't that think far.
sadurdaynight
I learned about her, ironically enough, from the female history teacher in elementary school who made it very clear she thought of Fonda as a traitor.
MAN9000
"greatest generation"
SeenItDoneIt
*is
Tracendo
My parents always talked such shit about her. Once I got the ability to find information on my own, I realized my parents are right wing nut jobs.
bluebombers1411337
She said that any American POW who claimed they were tortured by the Vietnamese was a liar. I can see how some people might hold that against her
glovelyday
Where exactly did she say that?
bluebombers1411337
Quick wikipedia search: "When stories of torture of returning POWs were later being publicized by the Nixon administration, Fonda said that those making such claims were "hypocrites and liars and pawns", adding about the prisoners she visited, "These were not men who had been tortured. These were not men who had been starved. These were not men who had been brainwashed.""
Seems like she believed whatever the NVA told her
glovelyday
Gee, sounds about as naive and gullible as the Americans who supported the war believing there was "light at the end of the tunnel" and if we didn't win the rest of Asia would "fall like dominoes".
chewybrian
A lot of boomers feel the same. My Dad drags me to the Elks and the VFW, and those guys lose their minds if you mention her w/o insults.
glovelyday
She's a boomer, so don't generalize. Vietnam vets are just a boomer subset. Hippies, anti-war protestors, and the first openly gay rights activists were all boomers.
chrisckelly
Weren't there similar subsets in the Greatest Generation as well, including hipsters, anti-war-protestors as well as openly gay rights activists? Surely, and entire generation didn't hate her.
glovelyday
The Greatest Generation had Beatniks (the Beats), some "hipsters" (Ray and Charles Eames), and some forward Civil Rights thinkers (MLK, the "Rat Pack"), but the "red scare" of the 40s and early 50s drove progressives underground and the vast majority of the GG were solidly conservative. The explosion of "youth culture", civil rights, and Vietnam changed everything. 1968-72 were an era of radical forment in the US.
BrockEffingSamson
Of course, "conservative" could actually mean they were conservative back then. Today, "conservative" means everything from fascist, to Christian nationalist, to accelerationist. Actual conservatives are the center-right-Democrats now.
rubypilgrim
It's important to understand that while there are parallels, what appear to be right and left divides in the 1940's, 50's and 60's were driven largely by WWII. That was such a monumental effort, and required such unity and sacrifice, that to hear any anti-military or anti-war talk was to them a visceral repudiation of everything they sacrificed so much for - including democracy. For the GG, the military is what preserved democracy. For boomers, they were taught to stand up for what was right.-
rubypilgrim
The Vietnam War was not at all like WWII. It wasn't even a declared war. And for the first time, people were seeing that war televised every night when they came home from work. Young men were being drafted before they could vote to go get ground into hamburger - for what? What good is democracy if you aren't free to exercise the rights ensured to you by the Constitution? We sacrificed everything for a free future, and the kids today are spitting on that sacrifice? WTF? so - conflict. -
SeenItDoneIt
There's a vast difference between speaking out against a war and visiting the enemy, posing with their anti-aircraft guns. If you lose someone close to you in a conflict, then anyone seen as giving "aid and comfort" to the enemy will be reviled. You may not like how older folks feel about her, but they are absolutely entitled to their opinions.
stxae9ud9x101
“aid and comfort “ you say…
CraicFiend87
And why were the Vietnamese your "enemy"? Because your government told you so?
DozerTheLab
I went through SERE and receive classified briefings on the Vietnam POWS. She caused real damage to those in captivity. Those soldiers didn’t want to be part of the war either.
lumpybear
100%
glovelyday
I am "older folks", and I am also entitled to my opinion. It was an unjust war that the US should never have become engaged in. It was a civil war, not a "domino" driven Communist expansion. It was waste of US treasure, and most importantly, young lives. You can hate on Fonda for giving "aid and comfort", but save some for the US governmdnt that destroyed 50,000 Americans' and millions of Vietnamese lives, and changed nothing.
migratingotter
The thing to remember is this was a fear reaction to “communist” countries that the far right used to start a war, persecute people who had different opinions, & make a ton of money(rich people with investments in manufacturing, developing & selling weapons & supporting military action) from governments and mercenaries. They are doing this now. If we don’t rein in big business and make them play nice with everyone, we will be in WWIII. Because everyone knows that wars are great for the economy
migratingotter
And economies around the world are stagnating from inflation caused by big business price gouging everyone and buying politicians to look away. The corporations are financing fascists fringe groups to stir up people who are finding it harder to make ends meet and steering them to blame immigrants and others as the problem when all that is needed is to tax the corporations and dismantle the monopolies.
Dellaaa
Well I get that but how many innocents were raped and murdered. That war is full of horrible events, both sides. Again we shouldn't have been there, we just followed in after other countries. Young men were drafted, the poor went and rich didn't. And the end wasn't a proud one in our history.
As a young teenager I saw the war on TV every day after school. I will never forget watching US forces blowing up a bridge with women and children, old farmers with livestock, a proud moment per news.
SeenItDoneIt
All war is horrific. I won't say nothing good ever comes from it, nor that no wars are necessary, but every damned one is horrific.
Dellaaa
And my older sister got a pen pal from news paper ad to support the troops. He sent her Polaroids of his boots on top of mangled bodies of enemy. Were they really? Why bragging enough to stand on a pile of bodies? She burned them, she was 16.
MsladyRiver
That’s horrific I’m so sorry she had to go through that what a horrible human being.