Just playing devil's advocate here: This is not hypocritical under the typical conservative's understanding of morality. They don't believe in an unlimited right to life. They believe people have a right to life, but that those who commit grave offenses forfeit that right. They also believe that fetuses have similar fundamental rights as those who've been born, so they believe that fetuses have a right to life, but that those receiving the death penalty do not.
If you want to have any kind of productive discourse with an American conservative, perhaps even change their views, these kinds of gotchas will get you nowhere. You have to meet them where they are and understand what it is they believe.
Just a reminder that a 6 week abortion ban is basically a total abortion ban. Many women don't realize they are pregnant at 6 weeks because 6 weeks pregnant is 2 weeks late for a period. It isn't uncommon for women to have periods irregular enough that 2 weeks late isn't unusual - even stress or changes in diet or significant amounts of exercise can cause irregular periods.
And I’d hazard a guess that even women with regular cycles would struggle to get an abortion. I bet there’s a bunch of horseshit stalling tactics enforced by the state to help push an abortion past that 6 week cutoff.
Not only that, for the most recent execution, the previous governor of Nebraska bought execution drugs on the black market with personal funds when the state wasn't able to get it through legitimate means.
I believe in the death penalty for child molesters. Murder? Idk. I could understand how an emotion could overcome someone like that. But literally preying on children just to F them up physically and mentally for their entire lives? You deserve to die.
To be clear, Nebraska has 439 on the ballot that will enshrine abortion rights into the state constitution. Unfortunately, they also have 434 which essentially gives the legislature the power to do whatever they want, up to and including a full ban.
Missouri's Republicans are good at delaying referenda so it took a while for the cannabis referendum to come up (2022) and it's taken time for abortion rights (this election).
We have a LOT of old people who are on medical marijuana due to a fucked up healthcare system in the state. But those same people are dangerously dogmatic about anything biblical. Seriously, they would follow Trump to hell and back, and all he has to say is "Jesus" to get it started. There's also a significantly sized younger portion of the voter base that ONLY voted for the marijuana measure and stayed home the rest of the time.
Related note : avoid the nerds ropes. It's a very popular new item in the state right now. It will seriously fuck you up WAY beyond what you would expect.
I stopped at nBliss in STL and picked up some honeybee gummies and chocolate. The chocolate bar was 300mg, divided into 20 pieces. Very nice ride. Most ive had was a 25mg chocolate cup from Michigan. I'd had 20mg before, but this one sent me over the edge. I was hugging a bucket. Didn't puke, but felt like I was going to.
These states also happen to have the worst healthcare outcomes, lowest literacy rates, and highest share of low income earners who’d thunk that and cherry on top they always vote republican…
As someone who spent 21 years in Idaho, can confirm. I tried as hard as I could to not have to venture outside the little blue bubble (in comparison to the rest of the state) that is Boise.
And if the federal Republicans get back in again, they will trash the economy so thoroughly, all these people in these poor states will be wondering why the feds aren't helping them anymore.
Are you suggesting there could be some sort of connection between having the worst outcomes in nearly every metric and the fact that Republicans are nearly completely in control?
Alas this is true but today’s swing state can be tomorrow’s blue state or worse red state. Just in the last 2 decades Florida and Ohio went from swing states to deep red states. Democrats have a legitimate chance to flip North Carolina and Georgia into blue states we just need to empower the electorate everywhere and turn people out. Democrats also do well when they are engaged…
Electoral College doesn't come into play when voting for school board, judges, sheriffs, municipal positions, governors, or legislative branches at any level.
POTUS doesn't have control over those problems. VOTING DOES FUCKING MATTER.
Read the sample ballot they send you, read up on the people, local news usually does a good job of showing both sides of an issue and know what you are voting for. Most government votes are public and on your local gov's website.
Where do you have to live to get *sent* a sample ballot? I've always had to look mine up online -- which admittedly is no harder than registering online was in the first place, but it's still something I have to go out of my way to do.
I get mine every election, as far as I know, I never signed up for anything, it just happened after I registered. I'm in Florida, different counties may do it differently.
I always got the feeling that they feel like permanency is a punishment for premarital sex and anti abortion has been a means to dissuade people from it. The bible says "no sex before marriage" but abortion has always been an option for those who still did it and got pregnant. Remove that option, and you reduce how many kids (usually) are having sex. Or so they think.
They want more babies in poor families (because the rich can always get abortions). This drives crime and legal 13A slavery, means more desperate workers for low-wage jobs, more consumers for cheap crap, boosts census numbers for political power for states, and if you're white even helps fight that "white genocide" they keep pretending exists.
"Pro-life" is just marketing anyway. Back when I was a kid in the '80s, they used to be called—by themselves as well as others—"Anti-abortion," which is way more accurate.
Well, it kinda sorta does, in a round-about way, but it's probably not what rabid anti-abortionists would want to hear anyway, even if they did decide to read the Bible once in a while. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordeal_of_the_bitter_water
Well, the idea seemed to be that if God didn't want the child to be aborted, then he would divinely intercede with a miracle and prevent the abortifacient from working.
Which, now that I say it out loud, I think we totally should rename all the various abortifacients "Bitter Water" to remind the Christians that if God didn't want the abolition to happen, he'll simply intercede himself.
captainnewbi
how has the death penalty impacted the violent and horrible crime rates in those states, hmm
swedeonamoose
Also only western country that still got capital punishment.
pirateninjaunicornattacksquad
Only the government is allowed to kill its citizens. And even then, only after they have concluded said citizen will never pay taxes again.
FellaWithUmbrella
Pro-life only until birth. After that you are just cannon fodder for second amendment rights.
ufoara
SpiteLip
over lay the infant mortality rates, and poor education investment and numbers and you'll see the pattern continue.
Tefdoon
Just playing devil's advocate here: This is not hypocritical under the typical conservative's understanding of morality. They don't believe in an unlimited right to life. They believe people have a right to life, but that those who commit grave offenses forfeit that right. They also believe that fetuses have similar fundamental rights as those who've been born, so they believe that fetuses have a right to life, but that those receiving the death penalty do not.
Tefdoon
If you want to have any kind of productive discourse with an American conservative, perhaps even change their views, these kinds of gotchas will get you nowhere. You have to meet them where they are and understand what it is they believe.
KawhiLeonardIsSenpai
Just claim your unborn kid is gay. The states will legalize abortion under the "death penalty"
Blabulus
Go away Idaho you ruin the mood on the west coast!
DukePhelan
I am starting to think not hanging all of the confederates at the end of the civil war was a big mistake.
SomeDetroitGuy
Just a reminder that a 6 week abortion ban is basically a total abortion ban. Many women don't realize they are pregnant at 6 weeks because 6 weeks pregnant is 2 weeks late for a period. It isn't uncommon for women to have periods irregular enough that 2 weeks late isn't unusual - even stress or changes in diet or significant amounts of exercise can cause irregular periods.
Thornaxe
And I’d hazard a guess that even women with regular cycles would struggle to get an abortion. I bet there’s a bunch of horseshit stalling tactics enforced by the state to help push an abortion past that 6 week cutoff.
7thor8thcaw
Great info. My wife had zero clue until at least 2 months with both of our youngest.
fartharder
Dimestream
Yeah Idaho sucks, I know. Lived here long enough to have a FIRM grasp on the statistics.
kinarism
Not only that, for the most recent execution, the previous governor of Nebraska bought execution drugs on the black market with personal funds when the state wasn't able to get it through legitimate means.
VitaminJay
ScootyPuffThe3rd
Does…does anyone really need THOSE states…
dasAchteck
"principles"
stonedlikeicheckedoutmedusa
fun fact: all federal executions since the 1970s have taken place in Terre Haute, Indiana
TrustMeImADog
If you abort your baby, we'll kill you, AND your baby. That'll teach you. Bet you won't have no more bobortions after that!
HerTheyCandybar
I believe in the death penalty for child molesters. Murder? Idk. I could understand how an emotion could overcome someone like that. But literally preying on children just to F them up physically and mentally for their entire lives? You deserve to die.
BarderBetterFasterStronger
Well this is just false.
NaughtyNinja74
Hey we are trying to change that shit in MO come this election. Amendment 3 is on the ballot after some R bullshittery
Subsound
Banning abortion is the death penalty for women with extra steps.
femenergy24
Not hypocritical in the slightest…smdh!
PleaseRespectMyAsshole
To be clear, Nebraska has 439 on the ballot that will enshrine abortion rights into the state constitution. Unfortunately, they also have 434 which essentially gives the legislature the power to do whatever they want, up to and including a full ban.
I already for 439 and against 434.
manhands
bible is problem.
Edutittam
Nebraska is really disappointing because the death penalty was banned until blood lover Pete Ricketts bought his seat.
BarderBetterFasterStronger
Shouldn't be on here though as abortion is not banned.
invaderjak
still so weird to me that weed is legal in MO, but abortion isn't. Like, how can you get a ballot measure to pass one but not the other?
SomeDetroitGuy
Missouri's Republicans are good at delaying referenda so it took a while for the cannabis referendum to come up (2022) and it's taken time for abortion rights (this election).
Kavrae
We have a LOT of old people who are on medical marijuana due to a fucked up healthcare system in the state. But those same people are dangerously dogmatic about anything biblical. Seriously, they would follow Trump to hell and back, and all he has to say is "Jesus" to get it started. There's also a significantly sized younger portion of the voter base that ONLY voted for the marijuana measure and stayed home the rest of the time.
invaderjak
Crazy. Was a welcome surprise when I was there for the eclipse though. Came home with some nice edibles. Much more expensive than Michigan, though.
Kavrae
Related note : avoid the nerds ropes. It's a very popular new item in the state right now. It will seriously fuck you up WAY beyond what you would expect.
Felderburg
Is that just https://www.nerdscandy.com/nerds-rope/ covered in marijuana?
Kavrae
These had homemade ropes made with marijuana (probably infused honey) and then rolled in nerds. "Covered in marijuana" would be a terrible time
invaderjak
I stopped at nBliss in STL and picked up some honeybee gummies and chocolate. The chocolate bar was 300mg, divided into 20 pieces. Very nice ride. Most ive had was a 25mg chocolate cup from Michigan. I'd had 20mg before, but this one sent me over the edge. I was hugging a bucket. Didn't puke, but felt like I was going to.
MustHailSagan
These states also happen to have the worst healthcare outcomes, lowest literacy rates, and highest share of low income earners who’d thunk that and cherry on top they always vote republican…
pinkmilkyway
LateNightBunnyParty
God, I fuckin' hate it here.
Fuckweasel
As someone who spent 21 years in Idaho, can confirm. I tried as hard as I could to not have to venture outside the little blue bubble (in comparison to the rest of the state) that is Boise.
ElusiveThing
Surely a coincidence... /s
truemetalman
Utah is a weird exception here. High literacy rate and good healthcare services in general. They're just all brainwashed by the LDS church.
Edutittam
Nebraska doesn't fit that mold at all.
thatwoodguy
And if the federal Republicans get back in again, they will trash the economy so thoroughly, all these people in these poor states will be wondering why the feds aren't helping them anymore.
Syxcfaq
Are you suggesting there could be some sort of connection between having the worst outcomes in nearly every metric and the fact that Republicans are nearly completely in control?
Everyonesfavorite
And bc of the electoral college if they live there and vote otherwise, it doesn't count or matter. 😒
MustHailSagan
Alas this is true but today’s swing state can be tomorrow’s blue state or worse red state. Just in the last 2 decades Florida and Ohio went from swing states to deep red states. Democrats have a legitimate chance to flip North Carolina and Georgia into blue states we just need to empower the electorate everywhere and turn people out. Democrats also do well when they are engaged…
Woestkonijn
Wait so even when everyone in the population votes blue, that college decides what the endgame is? Okay y'all need a revolution.
Everyonesfavorite
Woestkonijn
Wait so even when everyone in the population votes blue, that college decides what the endgame is? Okay y'all need a revolution.
Everyonesfavorite
TimbiquiDarkThirty
Electoral College doesn't come into play when voting for school board, judges, sheriffs, municipal positions, governors, or legislative branches at any level.
POTUS doesn't have control over those problems. VOTING DOES FUCKING MATTER.
Everyonesfavorite
My ARK (R) Rep is unopposed in my district. It takes $10,000 to get on the ballot. My district is solid red.
Intabih4
Read the sample ballot they send you, read up on the people, local news usually does a good job of showing both sides of an issue and know what you are voting for. Most government votes are public and on your local gov's website.
solarshado
Where do you have to live to get *sent* a sample ballot? I've always had to look mine up online -- which admittedly is no harder than registering online was in the first place, but it's still something I have to go out of my way to do.
Madalchemist2018
Not a red state.
Intabih4
I get mine every election, as far as I know, I never signed up for anything, it just happened after I registered. I'm in Florida, different counties may do it differently.
Nacon
In case anyone get confused by the GOP's statements... They're not Pro-life, they're just Pro-forced-birth.
Atomic2
I always got the feeling that they feel like permanency is a punishment for premarital sex and anti abortion has been a means to dissuade people from it. The bible says "no sex before marriage" but abortion has always been an option for those who still did it and got pregnant. Remove that option, and you reduce how many kids (usually) are having sex. Or so they think.
PoliticalWanderer
"We're pro-life... if it's a fetus and some overeducated doctor" says it's a necessary procedure."
"We don't give a shit about life if 12 local yahoos decide that you should die based on what a lawyer says."
tinybartender
They're not pro-life, they're anti-woman.
OneMoreLime
Anti-healthcare sums them up nicely. Or if you prefer pro-deathcare
TinyBadger101
I call them anti-choice if I'm being polite. I call them fetus-fetishist if I'm very annoyed.
Illithidbane
They want more babies in poor families (because the rich can always get abortions). This drives crime and legal 13A slavery, means more desperate workers for low-wage jobs, more consumers for cheap crap, boosts census numbers for political power for states, and if you're white even helps fight that "white genocide" they keep pretending exists.
vericon151
They are pro forced anything they want. They are the literal anti freedom party.
SteveMND
"Pro-life" is just marketing anyway. Back when I was a kid in the '80s, they used to be called—by themselves as well as others—"Anti-abortion," which is way more accurate.
Syxcfaq
Yes, but that's because the bible...uh, doesn't say a damn thing about abortion. Never mind.
SteveMND
Well, it kinda sorta does, in a round-about way, but it's probably not what rabid anti-abortionists would want to hear anyway, even if they did decide to read the Bible once in a while. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordeal_of_the_bitter_water
celestedrake
Not only abortion but witch-trial style abortion.
SteveMND
Well, the idea seemed to be that if God didn't want the child to be aborted, then he would divinely intercede with a miracle and prevent the abortifacient from working.
Which, now that I say it out loud, I think we totally should rename all the various abortifacients "Bitter Water" to remind the Christians that if God didn't want the abolition to happen, he'll simply intercede himself.