JustaNavyGuy
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Feb 5, 2019 6:00 AM
JustaNavyGuy
102700
2377
70
Attaroo
Suicide in general is up 33% since 1999, and the armed forces is the one place where women's rates are nearly as high as men.
Orktapus
The VA told me that my depression (that has 3 years worth of paperwork about how its entirely service related) isn't service related...
TardisRiptide
VA Crisis Line: 800-273-TALK. Use it if you need it and pass it on.
humaneffigy
I think these stats are hitting military enrollment.
Zedaroca
Let's hope so
vondruke
Not to diminish the affect of war, but how many suicidal people go to war hoping to die for a reason and a hero than a just another "loser".
ShoopDeDoop
To be fair, the number of veterans increases super fast, and the amount of military stays the same.
BirdmanPB
Well when some recruiters act like they are fuckin Oprah on a giveaway episode.
BillHubbard
The lesson here: don't sign up. You will be sent to places you do not want to be. If you survive you will be treated as trash. Not worth it.
Janusha
If you ever needed a gauge to show exactly how desperately USA needs a social system with proper healthcare, its this. 22 suicides a day.
ApologisingToSpidersBeforeKillingThem
How many deployed?
PaintYourWagon
I would be curious about this number too, people who enlist have a higher rate of mental disorders than civilians even before enlisting
Bollramm
HAve you thought about....not going to war like all the fucking time?
Dalael
The best way to take care of future veterans, is to stop voting in politicians that will send young soldiers in pointless wars.
kaarbaak1337
You should take your time machine back to the beginning of time and start enforcing this.
Zedaroca
I'd take the "young" from your sentence.
Dalael
Aren't most combat troops between 22 and 35? I'd call that young.
LegendOfTheCrack
Is it shocking to you that men are deemed disposable? It has been like this since the dawn of history.
whynotsneeze
Could it mean ppl urging for wars dont care about humans ? nooo
billautomata
Stop starting wars maybe?
B1GP7
Its almost they care more about the donors in the military industrial complex than the soldiers *shocked*
reineseele
"We can't compare it. Cause we don't care for it."-US politician 101 (if no one is lookin they stop caring)
Aquilarden
It's worth noting that when you see a lawmaker voted against something, it may have been a rider on a shitty bill. You could put VA >>
Aquilarden
>> funding on the end of a harsh gun control bill or an anti-net neutrality bill and make your opponents vote against it.
Se7enPr1me
Ive seen so many homeless vets in my town...that or they get their hats at an army surplus idk
pareidoliaperson
But are the stats really fair? Since 1999 depression epidemic was a thing, causing more suicides generally, and this may include the vets
ImBlueDobaDeeDobaDaDobaDeeDobaDa
Yes the stats are fair, look at that fucking number!
ImBlueDobaDeeDobaDaDobaDeeDobaDa
Oh 50,000 were due to the “depression epidemic”, that’s means only 12 veterans kill themselves a day... still fucked!
pareidoliaperson
What I'm getting at is, is it really bc they are vets or is it the depression epidemic?
ImBlueDobaDeeDobaDaDobaDeeDobaDa
Veterans account for 8 perfect of the population and 15 percent of the suicides
pareidoliaperson
What part of this proves or disproves my point?
Grandis
I think it’s numbers. Healing costs more then death. A ad but true.
Janusha
"your injury is not service related" is the default answer and then you are dropped.
PostmodernSemanticQuagmire
Similar to wartime tactics where soldiers would incapacitate enemies rather than kill them because of the tax on resources.
HunterHellquist
Yup. A dead soldier only needs buried, a crippled soldier will need Special Care for the rest of his life.
LaronX
While true, the cold hard truth is they only care for those people while they can use them.
hadtocreateanaccountguy
2.3 a day.
BjornFjord
As of 2016 the Department of Veterans Affairs had the number at 20 per day.
hadtocreateanaccountguy
Not disputing that. That is my average kill count.
goodguyC
Which means...US Military deaths since 1999: 133,753.
atarujun
Bingo.
tumppu
Counting it like that, their K/D really takes a hit.
galiean251
This fact should be higher.
RampantWolf
Killing people and watching people be killed takes something out of you. It's hard.
BigIrv5151
This cannot continue. We have to find a way to take care of these people.
MAN9000
Ironically, one of the key arguments against transgenders in the military is because they are more likely to commit suicide, but...
CriticalMinne
I havent heard that one yet but good point
Itwasmyname
Stat's already bad enough. Don't make it worse. /s
MAN9000
Or, it's their destiny!
vauhtihirmu
I dunno, that's like not letting white males serve since middle-aged white men (that they will likely become) have the highest suicide rates
Xaizer
I suppose the risk is that sending someone who already has a higher risk of suicide into combat is more of a risk to themselves and others.
Xaizer
A person who cannot deal with the pressure becomes a risk to others around them. Same reason there are minimum physical requirements.
Xaizer
You need to be able to count on the person next to you having your back.
Solkanarmy
I don't see the problem, you'd let other extreme body modders in, like the guys with horns, or bike chains through their faces
Vaanhalen
That's not true at all. Don't make shit up
Solkanarmy
my bad for assuming the US military was reasonable, thankyou for the clarification
Vaanhalen
Having a soldier sporting a chain through his cheek isnt "reasonable"
Solkanarmy
you're allowed to be there if you're missing a limb though, arguably that would differentiate you from others in uniform
kalallbea
Severely increased risk of suicide was a disqualifier for enlistment up until 2016(?)
AspiringAstronaut
I’ve heard that one. Why send a group already at higher risk of suicide into situations that sometimes tend to drive one to suicide?
LoudBirb
Well, the suicide rates are because of the treatment they get from the culture/people around them, not genetic. Denying them an avenue...
LoudBirb
For escaping the environment that's psychologically destroying them seems... unhelpful. Source:
LoudBirb
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5178031/
MAN9000
They get beer up, brake lines cut, socially smeared... Think you might be a little depressed?
ZiomalZParafii
But there was no war since 1999 on the USA ground, so.. why? Oh, invasions, "democracy", right. (hit me with downvotes baby one more time)
tumppu
Soooo, which war was fought on us soil in 1998?
ZiomalZParafii
Still none. Just referring to "since 1999" from the img for consistency.
CaptainFrito
Remember, the worst part are the movies where they say killing people made them sad
BajaHadzipesic
War crimes can go heavy on your mind.
tyrpestdeath
The VA was given hundreds of thousands of dollars to spend on suicide prevention in 2018. They didn't spend more than $60k. Google this.
tyrpestdeath
Oh, I'm sorry - they were given $6,200,000. https://www.militarytimes.com/news/2018/12/18/va-left-suicide-prevention-funding-unspent-report-
ImgurPlz
404
tyrpestdeath
Isn't the full link
steerAwwPrincess
Perhaps we should stop sending our young men and women off to their deaths. It seems war is now a business.
yoshi
nobody's forcing them to enlist tho
PCskele
And for the people who live there, it's a way of life
LurkerOfDarkness
It has been for a long time. Also fewer soldiers suffer these effects if the war is justified in their view, like WWII or Korea. Fewer not 0
tumppu
WW2 veterans' mental issues were a taboo for a long time at least in finland. Probably the same everywhere.
LurkerOfDarkness
Pretty much everywhere, but when you begin accounting for everything that is signs of PTSD you still come up short compared to today.
tumppu
And it's a bit late to start worrying about it now, since they're more or less gone (ww2 vets, I mean).
stuart1965
Has America ever been at peace for say 5-10 years ? - and what were the stats on veteran suicides then
USERNAME2010
Yes. That’s about the war cycle. The rate does drop. But is still high, the issue is Suicide on a whole is on the rise so it’s hard to tell
TheRealAethrys
If you're counting from 1776... is that a serious question?
kaarbaak1337
The military attracts suicidal people. It's a Catch-22.
TheRealAethrys
- Citation needed
seckzie
Every western soldier since 1900 or before, should take a real long hard think about what they are really fighting for, and against.
d0o0o0d
You really think non-western soldiers have better reasons for fighting?
seckzie
I think some of them do yes, not all of them. But even if they do not have better reasons, our reasons still sucks.
Zedaroca
Gee, if only Americans could stop mass murdering other people, maybe they wouldn't feel so bad. But I guess that would be too much.
kaarbaak1337
As opposed to every other country that never participates in war.
tumppu
Well, they mass-murder their own, too, so they think it's ok to murder others as well.
Zedaroca
That's a different look I never had.
CriticalMinne
This is crazy. So much money for defense yet the key ingredient is discarded. Human life just doesnt have much value to the ruling class.
ButterLube
No shit
bart2pl
nah ,just troopers , after they leave millitary they have no value to society, since they posess no real skill other then obey orders
DaNylz
Keep education expensive and there will always be enough recruits. Recruiting renters specifically open in black/latino neighborhoods.
UglyHorribleGrouchyOldMan
The VA is an incredibly well-funded agency. However, the VA is incredibly bureaucratic, mismanaged, and inefficient.
jrayflo
Think a fair amount of that is buying expensive things from countries they want to be on good terms with...international wheel greasing
thomerow
sahold
The Department of Defense(DoD) and Veterans Affairs(VA) have separate budgets. VA doesnt get the massive funding that DoD does.
Attaroo
Doubly brutal because the key benefits of being a veteran, education and health insurance, are basic in every other modern country.
BokkenRyder
Hehe "Defence"
FurtiveGlancer
What's the sucide rate of the general population? Other stressful professions?
MultiplePersonalitiesProfile
The money is not specifically “for defence” and more “for the defence contractors”.
DSVII
A 3 star general once told me.. We dont need you, you need us.. This is the Army if we need you, we take you
pacobedejo
Part and parcel of large scale, unjust murder.
ImgurPlz
I imagine the biggest expense in the military is the wonderful hardware budget. Human lives are cheap. Esp when they dont get VA benefits.
PixelSprite64
Human life is a self sustaining renewable resource. Easily cheap enough to be considered disposable. There will always be more. 1/2
PixelSprite64
2/2 Pls wipeout the human race and prove me wrong.
MechaTeddy
Money will always be valued over human lives in this system.
Lostchild12
Money, power, prestige, any system. Corruption is attracted to those.
MechaTeddy
I don't believe that's true. The challenge is designing out mechanisms that reward corrupt behavior and eliminating power structures.
Lostchild12
Sort of like the game between anti-virus makers and hackers.
n0th1n
Yea, that kinda is the core model of a military (money for killing).
MechaTeddy
and killing for profit
AurikNecal
What happens when you put liberals in control of... Literally anything.
ImgurPlz
LOLOL what the fuck does that even mean? The Ds want health care for vets (all), the Rs want more WMD/dead soldiers for oil interests.
AurikNecal
VA is filled with liberals, not conservatives. Hence the problem that appears, which is the same problem no matter where they control.
ImgurPlz
https://www.va.gov/opa/bios/secva.asp It's easy to point out liars when you have a source. The VA is ran by a Trump appointee. Go read some.
AurikNecal
Worst shithole cities in america? All democrat controlled.... I can argue this for hours, but whatever, nobody's gonna listen anyway.
IdiotSavantTinker
Is the VA a shithole city in the US, or are you changing the subject?
ImgurPlz
Are you imagining the south is a paradise of success and wealth? Or just Detroit and Chicago which is called Rust Belt for a reason.
tumppu
Humans are easy to mass-produce with unskilled labor. Produce enough humans and there will be enough numbskulls who pick military service.
pacobedejo
Feed welfare into the barracks building and Marines come out.
Pokedmeinthecoconut
I was in the Infantry. I completely agree with your statement, even if you were joking.
tumppu
Also helps if your courts have that jail-or-military -thing going (is that still a thing?).
TheRealAethrys
No, and it never has been, numbskull. https://www.thebalancecareers.com/join-the-military-or-go-to-jail-3354033
AnnieBahde
It’s subtler now. My brother got out of trouble because his attorney argued he was about to join the marines and surely that was better for
AnnieBahde
Him and our country for him to be a soldier than in prison. Judge agreed, gave him a suspended sentence and brother went to Iraq.
tumppu
Weird, because looking at other sites, it seems it indeed IS possible for that to happen, but rarely. Less now, than back in the day.
tumppu
example given: most likely outcome is a guilty finding, and a sentence that is “suspended” subject to your enlistment, acceptable >
IPoopOnCompanyTime
I know a couple of Nam vets that were given the option. Didn't see it all when I was in. Which I think is a shame.
TheRealAethrys
A power tripping judge can order whatever the hell they want. All but one branch explicitly forbids accepting it.
CommanderVimesAnkhMorporkCityWatch
TBF, I wonder how this compares to non-veteran suicides.. Stress in pretty Universal really..
GoddamnitClown
Total US suicides are about 14 per 100k. In the age/gender range of service people, more like 20-25? Veteran suicides are around 30. /1
GoddamnitClown
So it's almost certainly higher, but only a bit. Active duty deaths are just low. mentalhealth.va.gov/docs/2016suicidedatareport.pdf
Zujewski
Well, yes, but as a percentage vastly more veterans commit suicide than civilians.
VeiligheidsKrat
And you are not alone :) here is a publication on the topic https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4060831/
Sw1ftTurtle
There's this new thing called google where you could read about how it is lower because high levels of stress are much rarer for civilians.
Ber4nger10
Google: suicides in the U.S, 44,965 in 2016 alone. If 120,000 veterans have commited suicide since 1999, I think we can pretty safely >
Ber4nger10
Determine that more civilians have killed themselves than veterans. Not commenting on anything else. Just googled the numbers.
Sw1ftTurtle
Sure, but there are more civilians than veterans.
Ber4nger10
Yes and veteran suicide rate is double compared to civilians. I was googling just raw numbers.
Sw1ftTurtle
That would be like saying people with cancer are less likely to die because most people who die don't have cancer.
CriticalMinne
Can I find google on bing?
CatsIsTheAnswer
Why do people take it so personally when someone types a question on imgur instead of google?
Sw1ftTurtle
Because it is both laziness and the arrogance to assume facts can fully explained in 140 characters.
CatsIsTheAnswer
Nobody assumes that; you get lots of links, and from multiple perspectives
Sw1ftTurtle
I thought I did assume that, now I feel stupid.
IncredulousD
Lmgtfy.com
DavidHoag
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_in_the_United_States#/media/File:Total_suicides_in_the_United_States_1981_2016.png
DavidHoag
I think it says that equates to around 13 per 100,000. I don't know if that includes soldiers though.
DavidHoag
Wikipedia appears to show veteran suicide rate to be about double per capita.
TheFeralDog
itsACoppa
ignorantveil
That's the most concise and effective factual response I can remember. Well done.
StopAskingMeForAnAccountImgurIWannaLurk
Someone uses a night screen app
TheFeralDog
Nah accidently highlighted it while I was snipping the table from the Wikipedia page
thefatlonelyjew
Haha take that, women
TheFeralDog
Note: non vet women are 4 times less likely to commit suicide than men. But vet women have a higher rate than non vet men and woman combined
FreedomChargerGuy
TheFeralDog
?
SaltCollector
Well yeah... You don't add the rates together when you combine groups, you take a proportional average.
TheFeralDog
Shit I'm an idiot, you're correct! But don't ever show me I'm wrong again!
laaaaaal
Sad but interesting. While the number for male vets goes up it explodes for women.
gypsyspot
Rape?
loyalbabus1337
No thanks, I'm good.
mrmeseekslookatm3
Haha
Capnrory
Psychiatrist here: the big discrepancy in suicide rates between men & women is mostly due to men using more effective means (guns, hanging 1
Capnrory
jumping off things etc) compared to women (who usually take overdoses) - one might speculate that veteran women are more likely to use 2
Capnrory
guns in their suicide attempts than non veteran women, hence the suicide rate closer to the mens rate
SchrodingerMil
Ha jokes on you! I’m not gonna commit suicide I’m just gonna get cancer due to the materials I work with in the military! Checkmate bitch.
DJORock
It's not suicide if the military kills you first!!!
PartyManimal
Or als due to physiological trauma.
happenedtomeonce
Justapartofyourimagination
God damn burn pits.
ShutUpImWorking
HA you showed them! .. you die on YOUR Terms... also, Thank You for your service.
Katz00
Yeah my uncle was a seabee and came back and ended up with Parkinson's. Damn did he have to fight to get any help
supergrunt84
I’ve been thinking a lot about this lately. Can’t think of specific instances but I feel like the odds are we’re all going to find out some
supergrunt84
Bad news coming down the line. Can’t remember what brought it up,but I feel like every generation of veterans finds our they were exposed to
supergrunt84
Some shit
TheRealAethrys
I probably will because a recent article confirmed Holloman actually is the most toxic place on earth.
Barantor
What? I can't hear you over the massive amount of hearing loss I have the VA says didn't come from the military.
derekn
Yeah, I'm still not very positive that anthrax vaccine didn't fuck me up a tad. Or whatever the fuck was in Iraq.
barbarian818
IIRC, the biggest likely suspect for Gulf War Syndrome was the finely atomized DU and fumes from incinerated munitions
IndianStreamRepublic
I volunteered for that vaccine lol
GreedyJungle
Boy that ain’t just a military thing. I’m at more of a cancer risk than you out here in the oilfields doing fracking.
PlanePineapple
Not downplaying the risks you take, but your truck isn't built out of "depleted" uranium and it doesn't shoot DU at everything around it.
GreedyJungle
No instead our plasma cutters shoot radiation and we breathe in explosive dust all day.
KittensGivePaarthurnaxGas
What materials?
Djkb6718
Aircraft hydraulic fluid. Radar coolant. Jet fuel. Sealant. The list goes on and on. We're all gonna die anyways, so fuck it.
SchrodingerMil
Those are the ones.
InvictusxManeo
Used poop knifes
ObscureYoutubeReference
Old fecal cleavers?
IIikethecutofyourjib
I always upvote poopknives. Especially used one.
Hyero
Need those to make punji sticks
awscer
Uranium
Wijemi
Most likely also tritium.
awscer
Correction depleted uranium http://www.nbcnews.com/id/14321787/ns/us_news-military/t/armament-sickening-us-soldiers/
MisterLemons
Asbestos too
SchrodingerMil
Nope. Good guess though cause tanks
FUNKAPUS
Uranus*
KittensGivePaarthurnaxGas
How is it used, and what's it used for?
Wijemi
Depleted uranium is used on armorpiercing rounds and in tank armor.
KittensGivePaarthurnaxGas
But wouldn't that depleted uranium also have negative effects on the local populace, wildlife, and environment?
ComradeArmtyom
After reviewing your case, your cancer was not deemed work related.
Groznek
Neither are those lower back problems.
Kbantar
Sometimes the VA agrees your condition was caused by service even when it wasn't. I know someone whose diabetes was labeled that. 1/2
drunkenpolyanarchist
It's almost worth it to hire a lawyer versed in VA regulations to manage your claim. Even if you know it's not SC, 100% is a nice egg
Kbantar
Lifelong morbidly obese, smoking, sedentary, and with a very poor diet developed diabetes in his 60s. Sure it was Vietnam that did it.
Kbantar
Of course many were mess up by things like Agent Orange and other things then. My father lost all his teeth in his 20s. That ain't normal.
Kbantar
*messed
theginofgan
Here have some ibuprofen
CrimsonShinigami
But I'm allergic to ibuprofen
PlanePineapple
OK, then double the dosage.
AdmiralOutrageous
drunkenpolyanarchist
Service connected? Va says not likely.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Honor2552
How the hell do people still sign up for the military over there when everyone knows how the govt doesn’t care about you when you’re done.
drunkenpolyanarchist
Because of poor financial education and unrealistic expectations for early adulthood. Some kids don't think there's any other way out.
fortysw4rm
Because you get healthcare, college TA, 2.5 days of leave a month, tax free BAH/BAS, and now 401K matching.