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Jun 6, 2018 5:10 PM
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gloupin
France, the price are like 200€ / year with student social security (oddly we want you to stay alive). And, you can ask to waive the fees...
KarlPhylos
Foreign Medical Degree not recognized by this state’s medical board!? You mean it’s only valid back in Kazakstan?
TheSubWoofer
Legally moving to a country, and very most likely learning the native language. Holy fucking false equivalence.
Misfitsince1985
I'm almost positive the type of people who do that are not the same type of people who the 2nd person is talking about.
LEEEEROOOOYYYJEEEENNNKIIIINNNS
1) not every American shares that mentality. 2) if Europe is welcoming it then don’t hate on Americans for taking advantage.
ScrooblyDoobles
My sister hates social programs and voted Trump. She spent 2 weeks in the EU and now she wants to go to Germany for free edu. I was like....
Euronyme
Oh trust me, in uni she'll be asked plenty what she voted for considering she's american and all. And Trump is thoroughly hated here.
blazera
I had this thought already, but every college I looked into had out of country tuitions no better than US prices.
professionalConfirmologist
Look up studyportals.com, there r free EU options. Some require a 'crash course' language, which could be $$$, but some don't.
professionalConfirmologist
For what I wanted, Ireland & Finland offered free tuition, but boarding & food not included.
Dangermouse5
People moving for free stuff? Say it isnt so..
Necropoledancer
1. Big difference between entering a country legally for their free education and trying to sneak past the border illegally. I'm not saying
Necropoledancer
2. Whether the current laws on immigration and borders are right or wrong but there's a significant difference.
revelator
Right. The difference is legality.
Necropoledancer
1.Not just legality. I have friends of mine going taking a year abroad in uni, they've had to go through tons of checks and making sure they
Necropoledancer
2.Have enough money to provide for themselves etc. No country gives away a service completely free. Travelling legally means you make an
Necropoledancer
3. Agreement with whatever country or institution takes you and stops its being purely you taking advantage of their service and people
apercent
Education is for everyone as is all other social services
TygrF
Nothing is a "right" as long as someone else must be compelled to provide it.
stehenallein
I wonder if they snuck across the border illegally?
stehenallein
(I'm all for reforming immigration laws, as far as I'm concerned the more the merrier, but comparing this to illegal immigration is absurd)
IwishIwereKeithDavid
I wonder if the countries immigration process was stacked in such a way that it was easy to trip people up whi entered the country
506easy
https://imgur.com/AAl2fAN
DorkJedi
They don't need to, because those countries have sane, functional immigration systems.
stehenallein
You do realize the point of modern immigration systems is to bring financial assets into the economy? i.e. doctors, engineers, chemists, etc
stehenallein
While allowing 40,000 destitute migrants to walk across our southern border may seem a nobel cause-it isnt. These people are leaving their
ImSmallPleaseHoldMe
Hahaha no. It's so functional that a refugee in Germany (who should not be there) got killed in Belgium after trying to 'flee' to england 4x
ImSmallPleaseHoldMe
Child of a refugee* and they were in a van driven by people smugglers
aRootinaTootin
Also they 're not sharing a border with Mexico.
Euronyme
The EU is basically sharing a border with the middle east. We have more iraqi refugees in a county in Sweden than in all of the US.
Ionlyupvotestupidstuffandboobs
Those aren't refugees.
Polysloth
And remember, they are ex-pats and not immigrants
IDontLikeGermans
Germans often do that. After school they go to Austria and study at the university there.
ObiWanShalomi
Austrian buddy o mine got his arts major, then went to germany. He eventually decided to work with people.
LillithCat
Yeah... our right party is furious because of the "Germans that steal our places at the uni". As if they ever even saw a uni from inside
milad666
Legally entering a country to benefit is different then illegally entering and benefitting.
HockeyGuy1985
I will never understand peoples failure to differentiate between legal and illegal immigrants.
BarnibusSwarleyStinson
Plus they're still paying the taxes that pay for their education when they study there
leebeemariebee
And usually tuition, up to €12k per year (in Ireland anyway) if you don't get EU fee waivers
Traja01
Yea. Kind of a "who gives a fuck" difference, though.
milad666
Not really, one followed the laws and is paying taxes/tuition and not freeloading off taxpayers, one is freeloading off taxpayers....
Traja01
I'm glad you brought this up. Illegal immigrants contribute more to the tax pool than they take out. https://itep.org/immigration/
Traja01
So unless you're gonna give me shit for speeding (and yourself in all likelihood), your reasoning falls apart.
Traja01
And less likely to commit crimes than the native population. Link below.
Traja01
https://www.npr.org/2018/05/02/607652253/studies-say-illegal-immigration-does-not-increase-violent-crime
Badm0f0
Make them learn the language.
OneWingedWolf
I think they should :/
KresblainTheMagician
Better than having us recite the history of Rockall or some shit.
Rytam
As american that says this shit...its only fair. If i live there i should know their language. Fortunately, most ppl can speak english.
Badm0f0
Many countries have English as a 2nd language ( bilingual myself) but I find it ironic that most Americans can hardly speak proper English .
Badm0f0
I’m not saying all Americans, but I travel to Florida , Louisiana Ga & Texas (where I live) and have to call b/s to all the made up words
Rytam
We speak american english. Its a sub dialect
Badm0f0
Absolutely, I’m learning, words like “littler” “scrimps” etc
Rytam
Lol. I should be more accurate. American is a sub dialect. But then you have more subs under that. Those words are more southern. ...
Tea1earl1grey1hot
I had a few Americans in my class. It was great! Extra diversity and they were very talented so we learnt from each other, too.
keulenclown
So, you studied in California then?
Tea1earl1grey1hot
No they came to study in the UK.
GinjerbreadMan
Well when you're country values education, they try to make it available and affordable. Dumb people don't ask questions.
Florky
My state does tho.
officeandrec
*your
LiBearington
Hehe the irony
GinjerbreadMan
Damn...
LiBearington
It happens to us all from time to time.
GinjerbreadMan
You're too kind. Thanks
jakefromstatefarmmmmmm
(1/2) Random thought: as an American I like the idea of social services but our government is kinda scary and were scared to put hugely
jakefromstatefarmmmmmm
(2/2) influential and profitable industries like education and health care under government control
LincLoud
Look at the VA; that is government controlled hospitals and it's shit. The men & women who put their lives on the line get treated like crap
Lindead
Idea; maybe HEALTHCARE shouldn't be about fucking PROFIT.
jakefromstatefarmmmmmm
1/2Making things about profit is how you get the best things in most markets. US healthcare is really expensive to compensate for the amount
jakefromstatefarmmmmmm
2/2of money spent on medical research and pharmaceuticals that benefit the whole world. And people just shit on US healthcare.
jakefromstatefarmmmmmm
*not saying it perfect; I think everyone should have health care
ButtblasterMcAssmaster
But having them under corporate control is just objectively worse. At least the government has an incentive beyond profit.
jakefromstatefarmmmmmm
I trust profit-driven. Any hierarchy has poor/ suffering. But with our military/past actions... we're a few good speeches away from WW3
Seanspeed
Americans have no idea how shafted they're getting. Or if they do, their lack of education leads them to think it's a 'both sides' issue.
warmyourbeans
American here. "Life Scholarship" in SC almost covers tuition at state schools as long as you maintain a 3.0 GPA. Tech schools are covered
zoezoebelle
We're brainwashed to believe that the poor deserve to suffer and die. It doesn't even benefit anyone, just a sick cultural problem.
applesforjuice
A lot of us know exactly how shafted we're getting, and we have the best higher education institutions in the world btw
SeeHowItGoes
But who gets in to them and what is the standard of the education institutions that provide for the majority of your citizens?
Seanspeed
Which is exactly what the right wing wants them to believe.
DarthClitoris
I believe both parties are pitting the American people against each other so that one of the two parties stays in charge and they all $$$)
xyrax
This is just a fancy "Both sides". Same base argument though. An outright refusal to admit one side is worse.
skylin05
I know how shafted I'm getting and I realize it's not a both sides issue. If I could I would leave the US this instant and not look back.
skylin05
And the only reason I don't leave is because of money.
LincLoud
Basically. You also need to learn the language (unless you go to an English speaking country). I'd be comfortable living almost anywhere.
skylin05
I'm willing to learn the native language. I enjoy linguistics even if I never got fully bilingual.
LincLoud
I'm shit at learning new languages. Guess it's because I'm a dumb fucking American.
SonofAngus
Well are they doing it legally? Thats kinda the difference...
leebeemariebee
There's no way you're getting through all of the acceptance red tape for EU unis illegally. SO MUCH DOCUMENTATION needed! Also yearly 1/2
leebeemariebee
Visa renewals etc 2
Euronyme
You can't study in uni while being in the country illegally. It's impossible. They have to know who you are to grade you.
RedIronCrown
Yeah, no one ever gives legal immigrants grief in the US. Just doesn't happen.
removekarling
Trump is only coming down on illegal immigrants /s
DarthClitoris
Idk anyone here in the US that is bothered by legal immigrants
RedIronCrown
So I guess they should all wear their green cards on their sleeves to keep from being harassed.
DarthClitoris
No, I work almost exclusively with immigrants and there's no way to tell whose legal and whose not. The economic and social impact is notcbl
LinearAlgebro
it really isnt common...
AreYouMyGuppy
Didn’t the US once imprison everyone who had some form of Japanese heritage in internment camps? In recent history?
RedIronCrown
... unless you don't speak English. Or are visibly Muslim or non-Christian. Or are Mexican, then you're presumed illegal near as I can see.
LinearAlgebro
well yea if you don't speak english and come come to an english speaking country, youre gonna have a bad time
RedIronCrown
What's the official language of the US again?
opc3000
Americans moving to Europe for free college, are they staying there for jobs?
HardCaulk
Not so much. The job market and standard of living in United States is hard to beat. America is like playing life on easy mode.
cromarty
Most of the Americans I studied with stayed for a few years, but inevitably went home. This was in the 80's, so may have changed since then
leebeemariebee
Not usually, unless you fall in love, get married and stay. You typically get 1 year work visa after graduation but after that you're like 1
leebeemariebee
Every other immigrant trying to get residency aka super hard 2
zlumak
College in EU is not free, taxpayers pay for it.
trippingthelightfantastic
Yes, and they're getting something for their money.
zlumak
Absolutely. For us it's just a delayed payment though.
Caramster
And by that you don't risk inheriting poverty, everyone got the same chance for education regardless of class.
Euronyme
I guess that notion is more palpable in European countries with a nobility than in the US.
Caramster
It has nothing to do with nobility or not, it all has to do with solidarity.
EricFromAccounts
Mhmm and they get that money back after graduates pay income tax in the jobs their degrees got them. Better than a generation in debt, no?
zlumak
Definitely. It is not free however. The payment is delayed and shared.
EricFromAccounts
Of course payment is delayed, that's how "investments" WORK.
ZOMGNO
Which means you get to pay for your education your whole life. Brilliant! I love paying my taxes, they make my country greater.
Lindead
Just like healthcare. Oh wait, in US both you and gov. pays for healthcare and if you can't afford it then just die. Truly land of wonders
highexpectations
Depends on where in europe.. the entire continent doesn't have the same policy.. the schooling in the netherlands is rather expensive
Potetgull92
Yes, that's a good thing. It spreads the stress cost of education (and healthcare) over an entire nation instead of a single person.
TectonicTerry
As long as that person is also a tax payer, i agree.
zlumak
Most college grads turn into ta players, it's just a delayed payment.
Euronyme
So we should stop accepting Americans, huh? More people and cultural differences in uni is never bad.
Yavin1v
but students can often not be taxpayers...
Evanrudeplz
As an American, I applaud their exodus. We've fucked up healthcare and higher ed; so by all means go somewhere that does it better.
Euronyme
Can anyone explain the argument to not fund education with tax money? It seems like such a simple payoff structure.
superbob201
Mostly TAX=BAD, with a strong dose of Mammony being the biggest religion in USA.
DickInAToaster
They just pay for it in taxes.
SteelTech
Depends on their tax bracket. In the US the biggest tax cut was for those making millions a year.
DickInAToaster
Whats that have to do with anything? We’re talking about countries that provide education and healthcare.
SteelTech
I guess you're right....you can't pay for education and healthcare with money from taxes. Totally impossible.
DickInAToaster
How can i be right about that when I never even said that or even insinuated it...?
LincLoud
I am not against it but think we should be focused on un-fucking it up.
SteelTech
With a GOP controlled Exec/Leg....good luck.
LincLoud
It didn't exactly happen under Obama either. The problem is less about the party and more about corruption
SteelTech
I guess there was no one running in the last election primaries that stated he wanted to fix higher ed....NO ONE...
LincLoud
If you mean Bernie, he didn't get the primary vote and it was basically rigged against him. His plans wouldn't fly anyhow. Getting the ->
SomeGeographer
Thanks to Obama I can't get denied health insurance anymore for having a preexisting condition. That makes it affordable for me now.
OneWingedWolf
How is US postgrad education "fucked up?" The US has, by far, the world's best. It's just expensive. But you agree to the debt going in.
Evanrudeplz
No you're right. Just like we have many of the best practitioners in the world. But the fact that both are a money making scheme is stupid.
Evanrudeplz
I'd gladly pay much more in taxes if it meant socializing our higher ed and healthcare.
LincLoud
Dear god no! Can we fix it before we do that? Look at the VA; we can't take care of soldiers coming back from active duty, how can we handle
LincLoud
the other 99% of the country? We should fix the VA, if we can do that, then I'll believe in socialized medicine within the US
superbob201
The VA could be easily fixed if its funding went through the DoD
OhWowYouCanChangeUsername
All you American millennials who's always complaining about the lack of jobs and expensive college:
IsThisPirateTaken
Most millennials are already past college, at least the bachelor's. Are master's also free?
OhWowYouCanChangeUsername
Probably. I don't know anything major other than dentist that you have to pay by yourself
vauhtihirmu
In Finland yes but you have to be from the EU or ETA.
OhWowYouCanChangeUsername
Just come over here to Denmark, you'll get free education, free health care and we don't have enough people to pay for the baby boomers
MrTacoPower
I'll stay in America.
SmolTenk
Same with Germany.
skylin05
I'd gladly come but money.
RisingPhoenix92
How hard is it to learn the language because im a stereotype when it comes to learning foreign languages
OhWowYouCanChangeUsername
Danish is a fucking bitch, but most people speak English too, so you can kind of ease into it I would think
NegativeSilence
Free health care, you say? My wife and I have really considered this, but she's a T1 Diabetic, so not having health care is a deal breaker.
Ckenteris
For Germany its not "free" free, you pay 7.3% of your income. I could imagine Denmark is similar.
OhWowYouCanChangeUsername
It's paid through the high taxes
NegativeSilence
I'm paying nearly 20% of my paycheck every week at the factory I work at for healthcare. 7.3% is a SIGNIFICANT savings compared to that.
aji7sai
But it's cold!! Why do all the awesome countries have to be cold...
vauhtihirmu
In Finland we were mostly piss poor because we were cold and couldn't grow much, and ruled by rich foreigners for most of our history. (1)
vauhtihirmu
After independence and due to the possibilities of the industrial revolution we had both the understanding and resources to put effort (2)
vauhtihirmu
to educate the population, and enough solidarity from the shared experience of being poor that we wanted to offer the opportunities to (3)
arkemiffo
Winters can be dreary, but the summers almost magical.
OhWowYouCanChangeUsername
It's almost 30C outside today, and it's fucking terrible
arkemiffo
That's why you take vacation in June or July and basically live on the beach.
BronzeLeaguePro
And then the US loses highly educated smart people and Europe gains them...
EroticZombiePants
Yeah but we are gaining Doctors from India and the Middle East at least.
AaronPaulSturtevant
that's why berlin is happy to be paying for their education. it's a plus for the city when all is said and done.
DeezN00tz
Official Slogan: Berlin, poor but sexy!
CaptainLegot
They weren't highly educated when they were in the US. Try thinking about it as the world gains a highly educated person who's not desperate
skylin05
If the US didn't want a brain drain it should have done a better job of making it an appealing country to live in.
juniorjim
A Republican’s dream come true
AwesomeoOo
It's actually the other way around. French here. We provide one of the best higher education in the world but a lot of our students 1/2.
AwesomeoOo
are being sought out by american companies that offer them a higher salary to come work in the US. Really a classic scenario . 2/3
TigerWalt
Not if they move back after getting a degree
kitterbee
The university in my hometown absolutely has a problem w brain drain. Worth it to mention I left my HT because I went to uni somewhere else.
CurlySwede
Know a couple, none of them went back. Of course this is only my personal experience.
Ravenwing14
True! But say 50% stay (almost defs more in reality). I bet tuition for 2 foreigners costs less than tuition+childcare costs for one local.
ActionJohnnie
Once you go German, there’s no returnin.
Contemo
I came back...
VioletMoonRising
Why would they if they could get a visa? U.S is going to shit pretty quickly.
leebeemariebee
usually you get 1 year work visa after your degree in EU, after that it's like starting from scratch bc years in uni don't count
titsnsplits
It’s difficult and expensive to get a work visa at least here in the UK.
VioletMoonRising
I don't think UK is the country people are talking about though, they aren't going in a much better direction than the U.S.
FiftyShadesOfCauliflower
Brain drain. That's why immigration countries have become world leaders. All great empires in history were multicultural hubs & melting pots
BronzeLeaguePro
Brain drain means that you take people from the small top 10% of the population. That's not the same as todays mass immigrations.
LincLoud
Hasn't China been fairly ethnocentric and existed the longest of all?
Fedotia
They have minorities, the muslim one is repressed in blood.
LincLoud
Is that an ethnicity or just a religion?
Fedotia
Ethnicity, this one (Uyghur) happens to be muslim. Tibetans are having it rough too.
Euronyme
Well, China has really never really been a world leader. They've had rather little impact.
LincLoud
They have the second highest economy, many countries outsource work to them and do trade with them. They have a large impact, they're just->
LincLoud
very quiet about it.
FiftyShadesOfCauliflower
Chinas ethnic Han majority hasn't always been this homogenous. They've swallowed other cultures left and right throughout the centuries, ...
FiftyShadesOfCauliflower
which then became sinicized over time. Just like immigrants from many nations melted into one white American majority culture.
LincLoud
But swallowing isn't the same as a melting pot and didn't Germany and other countries admit the 'multicultural experiment' failed?
FiftyShadesOfCauliflower
"Germany" admitted no such thing. A Christian-conservative chancellor opened her flap without thinking, like she often does. Merkel also...
FiftyShadesOfCauliflower
And of course cultures swallow smaller ethnic groups over time and become more homogenous. Look at "white" America.It wasn't too long ago...
RedIronCrown
Already happening, France offers funding to climate change scientists who've lost their gigs under the current US administration.
Contemo
Didn't they make a big deal when 6 people went?
SomeGeographer
Because those 6 were project chiefs & held higher up positions. I work for the USGS & we keep losing people who got climate jobs in Europe.
Contemo
And how do those jobs in Europe pay? I imagine these people are going more on ideological grounds than $$ one's
SomeGeographer
Close to the same pay but the pay comes with far benefits when you consider in social services like healthcare and childcare.
AwesomeoOo
Still. Trust me, it's much more well paid to be a scientist in the US rather than in France.
ocegur
But you get the French social system, makes a lot much cheaper. US salaries might be higher, but positions are equally difficult to get.
iwouldshootobytwice
And US scientist salaries don’t get you very much here unless you are far along and very successful
RedIronCrown
It is if the science you work on is still being funded.
AwesomeoOo
True.We (French here) do have a lot of opportunity as we are very research oriented. But you kinda do it more out of passion than for money
iwouldshootobytwice
It is definitely like this in the US too
RedIronCrown
Same here in Canada, research science is more reputation driven than money driven.
AwesomeoOo
Unless you are funded by the private sector. A researcher will win around €40K a year. In the Us its around $60K. right ?
MrDirtyEars
Studying abroad isn't exactly a new thing
whooshby
My daughter just finished a semester in England. We paid the same tuition to her U.S. school, they just have an arrangement.
Euronyme
Do you know what the argument is not having tuitions being tax funded? I've never understood that about the US.
Ionlyupvotestupidstuffandboobs
State Universities are tax funded, which is why in-state tuition for residents is considerably lower than out-of-state.
Arrrrgggggghhhh
GreenYawgmoth
I've studied several broads myself.
AshmoreXII
What did you learn?
ObiWanShalomi
My mom told me she's not happy with the sex you gave-I MEAN the drawing you made
Ravenwing14
It's typically been MORE expensive though, so usually for wealthy. Tuition in Canada costs many times more for exchange students. This (1/2)
RisingPhoenix92
Living in New England I seriously considered going to McGill Uni but decided on a state uni instead
Ravenwing14
McGill is a great school...for quebec natives. It's twice as much for non-Quebec natives (despite other provinces not doing that to quebec)
Ravenwing14
and twice as much again for international. You made the right call I'd say unless you wanted mcgill for a specific reason.
Ravenwing14
going abroad for CHEAPER education is only recently becoming common place.
opisonthetoillet
When I tell Europeans how much I owe in student loans
HardCaulk
Yes, but the catch is that by working in the US you can afford to pay those loans back. Stay in Europe and you might have no debt and no job
Sjrko
*laughs in european*
tannenbanannen
“What, did you go to school for seven hundred years??” -Norwegian exchange student to my med school cousin, probably
Arsikere
i'm becoming more convinced that this has been designed as a system of legalized enslavement to the state
vauhtihirmu
Wouldn't it really be the banks you're enslaved to? And ofc to making as much money as you can while you live.
theWholeTiddy
Ding ding ding
crimson1221
Had a Scottish roommate owed $0 for her PhD... wtf are we doing
OmnibusLatinName
Creating a greater divide between the rich and poor. Gotta keep people working and in fear,keep em from seeing; swamp em in dept.
hungitalianohwaitthisisntgrindr
most people don’t pay tuition to get a PhD....... it’s covered by a stipend which ends up paying them to get their PhD.
crimson1221
Let me rephrase, she owed $0 for everything up to and including her PhD.
hungitalianohwaitthisisntgrindr
honestly it might be the same here if our entire country was the size of one of our small states.
aurthadi
Free education in Scotland for citizens, and even for immigrants if they have lived there for 3 years.
Misha49
“Free” education
Billy2sweet
And I get to wear a man skirt?!?! Brt
Psykodelic
I'm moving to Scotland lol
crystal5213
Yeah but then you’d have to live in Scotland
shanejorgedoriansamirjermaine
InTheDistanceAPlaintiveEnglishHorn
And then in England and Wales it's exorbitant and uni education is getting worse while also more expensive.
callmethelizardqueen
So like the states?
InTheDistanceAPlaintiveEnglishHorn
Possibly. The UK and the US have this suicide pact where they fuck themselves together I think.
egonBWONG
So it costs ABSOLUTELY nothing? No taxes nothing? REALLY?
nightof11bangbangs
Fuck yea i could live in scotland
BrawndoTheThirstMutilatorIsWhatPlantsCrave
*conditions may apply
BrittishIce
At any age?
BigFatBobbie
Can I come there? I do not even need education- just a bed and some food.
OliverClothesoff70
If you can live OK & get by there, that's an enormous cost savings. University in the USA is easily $100k for a somewhat inexpensive school.
pineapplesonimgur
And Scots-person want to get married? I bake and deep fry things
StarrryNight
How you doin'
pineapplesonimgur
HerbertLomNomNom
Scotland up shit creek once the yanks realise they also have oil.
yakovsmirnoffbiggestfan
Don’t worry. Most Americans know how shitty Scots are and don’t want to go.
godofnope
Fuck you ya wee Tory
RoutemasterFlash
Yeah, like that time they invaded Norway, remember?
adam1111
Could a half-English half-Scottish person get a free tuition if he had a Scottish passport?
InTheDistanceAPlaintiveEnglishHorn
No such thing as a Scottish passport.
Mozzeltoff
AFAIK, scotland does not YET have it's own pass., sharing the 'United Kingdom of Britain and Northern Ireland' one. There's talk though.
Mozzeltoff
Scotland, still being part of the UK, defines scottishness as residency, not nationality.
AreYouMyGuppy
Based on residency, so move up here for a while and *yesss*
PotterHeid
For residents. Sadly theres no such thing as a Scottish citizen :( I’m a scot living abroad and I can’t vote in Scottish elections - only UK
AreYouMyGuppy
The flip side is long term residents who aren’t citizens get to vote, which is pretty good given they are more directly impacted
AreYouMyGuppy
E.g. EU residents who’ve lived for years in Scotland without needing citizenship, but still pay taxes, use schools, work etc
InTheDistanceAPlaintiveEnglishHorn
EU citizens only, AFAIK, but there is no minimum residency requirement.
AreYouMyGuppy
Of course, you’re right. Residency not required either for uni or voting for EU citizens.
SkittleBomb
*free to all citizens from the EU countries except the English.
Vangis064
Scotland and England have had a rivalry for millennia, why stop it now
JRRRRRR
We get the honour of funding it though :)
StarrryNight
Cus no one in Scotland pays any taxes according to the English :)
Couchguy303
Free? The professors don't take a salary, books don't cost, and there are no room and boarding bills? That's amazing! How does it work?
StarrryNight
You see we don't pay executives millions of quid to go by private yachts while the rest of us suffer. Genius isn't it!
Rulweylan
1) Get England to pay for it, 2) Charge the English to use it, 3) Moan about the English.
FragileReality
Found the Englishman
Rulweylan
Yep. You can usually spot us, we're the ones with the Scotsman's hand in our wallets
FragileReality
And a teabag up your arse, apparently.
AreYouMyGuppy
If this is the case 1) why’d they want independence and 2) why is uk gov against?
Rulweylan
1) Nationalists don't tend to be that bright. 2) The UK government generally opposes any loss of territory, no matter how expensive.
Anthemius
Why is the British government against independence? Wow, gee, don't know. Why is the eu against brexit?
toasteheh
"Free" ... you do realize this is paid for through taxation?
StarrryNight
Free at the point of service. For those who struggle with the concept.
DevonLacroix
Would you rather have a society filled with affluent intellectuals or dirty homeless people?
toasteheh
Where am I saying that? Im saying its not free, people are paying for it..
DevonLacroix
Nothing is free. Your contention is political double speak: To talk without saying anything at all.
toasteheh
No, because you buy into the perception that anything government run is "free", and anything that is privatised "Cost money". Its stupidity.
DevonLacroix
I mean I know this is America so you can have both at the same time, but just generally speaking...
WhoSaidYouCouldEatTheLastCookie
My uni in Dundee, Scotland charges 7k a year to international students
AllThingsHotRod
Only 7000? My college tuition was 15000 a year...
ShadusMacAoidh
*sobs indebtedly*
AreYouMyGuppy
But not EU citizens or people resident in Scotland long enough to qualify - which isn’t a particularly long time
JadeEye
Abertay or UoD?
0xBAADF00D
“Uni in Dundee” == Abertay
JadeEye
There are two unis in Dundee :)
0xBAADF00D
I graduated from Abertay a few years back. My point is that you rarely hear “studied in Dundee” from UoD students, more often “at”.
Lykasmitts
going to GIC in sept, 8000pounds a Term for year 1, twice that for years 2 and 3. shits expensive but at least I can get a degree.
BurbleNutz
Ex-GIC and currently in UoG student here. Good luck.
Hypnoticcow
This is cheaper than out of state tuition cost for a community college within the US, I paid $9000
Hypnoticcow
Still worth every penny
Hypnoticcow
Fuck, I coulda went to Scotland
Mozzeltoff
As a English lass in Aberdeen- 9k a year.
godzillasgreatleader
6k a year as a staff dependant (step dad was a prof at another campus) half off for one year back in 2000 to 2006 @ Purdue Univers.
AreYouMyGuppy
Dope ass college campus though, and a beach (you’ll only visit a handful of times). Makes it worth it, right?
Mozzeltoff
I'm still mad at them- they closed down my depart. while I was doing my finals. I had 'do it yourself' courses (mini thesis) to get credits.
AreYouMyGuppy
So... not worth it. I had friends who suffered when they closed down the Swedish (or Nordic language?) dept during their degree.
darksteihl
Just $9k? Looking at that for the low end junky schools over here in the US. Expect $30+ for a good uni
Mozzeltoff
£9k, so closer to $12k, for tuition. Scotland is nice and let's you get a MA in 4 years, last year free. So yes, cheaper than USA.
Mozzeltoff
With student loans, my current debt (which gained/gains interest) is $72K. But I pay it off like a tax, and only when earning more than £10k
DrMichaelMcQueeferton
English people have to pay tuition in Scotland right? It’s been a while since I was in the uk
RoutemasterFlash
Yep, thanks to the votes of Scottish Labour MPs. Thanks, guys!
FoxyOwl
What about a UK/USA dual-citizen with both English and Scottish parents who has never lived in the UK?
LeGrandPeg
Um, you might be ok...
LeGrandPeg
Had a quick look into it. It's complex. If you had a UK passport and lived to Scotland prior to applying you might be ok. Check out the...
LeGrandPeg
SAAS website - you should find eligibility info there.
FlashBambi
You don't have to be Scottish, you just have to live in Scotland. My dad's Scottish, but I'm still not eligible.
FoxyOwl
I've lived almost my entire life in Kansas. :(
FlashBambi
Yeah, I've heard that Americans don't tend to travel that much outside the country. You should, there's a whole world out there!
RoJoMo
Yep English have to pay, but European Union students get to study in Scotland for free
FlashBambi
It does irk me a lot that Scotland essentially uses funds from England to let any EU citizen study for free, except those from England
StarrryNight
Yeah everyone up here in Scotland loves paying no taxes what so ever at all. Thanks England!
FlashBambi
England are net contributors to the UK, Scotland are net receivers. Therefore England funds free tuition in Scotland, but cannot enjoy it
xizar
Don't you pay afterward and only if you get a job that pays well enough to let you pay?
FlashBambi
No, that's how the loans work in England. Scotland let's you study completely free provided you live in Scotland or the EU, but not England
xizar
Both of those are a orders of magnitude better than what is had in the USA.
RoJoMo
No you have to pay 5% of yr salary in Scotland after £21k a year salary if you took a loan (if you didn’t is all free)
aurthadi
If an english student moved to Scotland and lived there for 3 years before starting studies would be free.
aurthadi
European law forbids discrimination between member states, so if Scottish students go free, then so must every other EU student.
LeGrandPeg
It's also how the loans work in Scotland. My already very low tuition was paid for by the Scottish Government but I still required loans to
LasciviousHedgehog
Yes mainly because university is funded from the Scottish block grant. England could do the same from the UK budget but don't.
Treblaine
Evi1Gav
Actually Scotland did it by cutting 140,000 college places and forcing more severe austerity than the rest of the UK.
Rab13
It's so easy to spot the English people that blindly follow the media in these comments....
AreYouMyGuppy
Okay interesting. 1) free education was in place before Tory austerity, 2) Scotland has free prescriptions, no bedroom tax, baby boxes...
Rulweylan
A deficit of over 8% of GDP paid for by English taxes...
AreYouMyGuppy
And a better funded nhs, lower waiting times, amongst other examples including the *free education* that don’t exactly screams austerity
WhoSaidYouCouldEatTheLastCookie
Which is why Scotland is better, and we have free prescriptions too
IHateCaptchaCodes
(due to Under18/Benefits/Over60, etc) or certain conditions that are exempted; plus an annual certificate caps your cost at £104 anyway /2
IHateCaptchaCodes
Always thought its weird for the rest of the UK not to copy that one- especially as probably half the population are exempt already /1
Rulweylan
England got tuition fees because Scottish MPs voted for it (if they'd abstained, the bill would have failed).
RoutemasterFlash
The decision to charge English students tuition fees passed partly because Scottish MPs voted for it.
Dravit
Also Scots hate the English despite the fact the English subsidise all the devolved nations.
LasciviousHedgehog
Regions in the UK will vary. Some will be better in certain respects but worse in others. Just makes the case for federalisation stronger.
WhoSaidYouCouldEatTheLastCookie
Scotland is a country, one that wants to be part of the EU and independent of the rest of Britain. Don't mistake the UK for the US
Rulweylan
Scotland also has a massive deficit paid for by English taxes. Anyone looking to freeload off others should fit right in there.
TFPPUD
1) Scotland's oil revenues have been spent by the UK Government to cover short-term tax cuts.
lncorrectGrammerNazi
Pissing off Scotland?
RoutemasterFlash
Bluntly put, but yes, the net flow of cash is from England to Scotland. Actually it's more like from London to the rest of the UK...
Rab13
Where have you got your terrible knowledge from? The mainstream media because Scotland pays way more tax per head than England....
monochrony
no nation is perfect. what is important, is how they distribute their budget to the people.
LiBearington
Well that's funny because I can assure you the people going to Europe for "free" education is on the side of open borders.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
"on the side of open borders" You misspelled "better people"
TheSpeakerOfTheHouse
"Look at meEe, I'm better than you because I believe a thing and I assume you don't because I'm just better, WAY better, you dumb peasant."
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
It takes a closed mind to hate open borders.
TheSpeakerOfTheHouse
1. You assume hate. 2. That's a shitty catchphrase. 3. No amount of idealism is going to change reality to suit the map in your foggy head.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
1. ALL Rightist hate. 2. That's not a catchphrase. 3. No amount of idealism is going to make your delusions more workable.
MrInconspicuous
Most likely true but you'd be surprised how blatantly hypocritical some people can be.
SmolTenk
its not hypocritical, its egoistic. They take cause we are "stupid enough" to give, while they are "smart" and dont.
Metallica93
Did you miss the sarcasm in the original post? This was a dig at conservative isolationism and border policies.
MissingImage
Yea, you're right. Americans are widely known for their reasonable attitudes.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
It tends to take a closed mind to be against open boarders.
TheSpeakerOfTheHouse
You're right, China was pretty close minded about the Mongols.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
Look at how far back you must take your example. We live in a time of continental superstates and nuclear weapons...
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
I welcome a world government of autonomous regions. It is conspiracy theory nonsense that hates the idea.
TheSpeakerOfTheHouse
Have you ever lived next to people who shit in the gutter?
DonnieDangles87
Tell me how an uncontrolled influx of people is good for border communities? Increasing student/teacher ratio, lowering the amount of...
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
Should not BE borders.
Hercules99
Honey, humans are far from living without borders.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
Honey, you are far from living without a helmet.
DonnieDangles87
Tell me how an uncontrolled influx of people is good for border communities? In reading student/teacher ratio, lowering the amount of...
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
There shouldnt BE borders. Everyone should be able to go everywhere.
DonnieDangles87
Available jobs, available housing. Who will teach them english, how will they support themselves/family. Answer these questions.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
They should not BE forced to learn English.
DonnieDangles87
Are you fucking serious? That's like saying you should deserve a job as an engineer but not be forced to learn math.
DonnieDangles87
Imagine if everyone spoke a different language in america....how fucking inefficient that would be.
DonnieDangles87
Imagine if we all used a different math base-system or a different currency from state to state. It would be so fucking dumb.
zpaddy
Open borders and open information within the EU ain't so bad.
njorunn
Depends on if you use it or not. Also migrants exploited the Schengen to move from country to country. So it's not completely good.
LiBearington
Except the migrant crisis that's causing most of Europe to rage quit right now..
ZimGenzko
Not even half of Europe is rage quitting, England did, Italy might and the poorer countries can’t afford it, the richer profit too much.
zpaddy
Yeah I'm principle it's good, the issue is that people abuse weaker borders to get into the EU then can move about freely.
LiBearington
Which is a problem, as much as I would like to help more people.. It leaves open too much room for malicious people to hide behind children.
zpaddy
I benefit a lot as I'm in scientific research but I'm guessing much of the population don't see the immediate benefits.
numnut1987
Thats a 2 way street, you dont live in a poor neighborhood wher these imigrants will live, nor will they compete jobwise with you.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
If you cannot compete with a person thats just arrived... thats your fault. Take some... personal responsibility.
zpaddy
I'm in scientific research, not rich! Live in pretty poor area. Was also at London bridge so there's that. Still stand by my first comment.
infamousxiii
well they are probably also following legal procedure for immigration rather than sneaking over.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
They would not put you in dog kennel fencing like we are right now either.
mukenwalla
Most illegal immigrants do just that, but just don't leave when the visa runs out
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
Thats true.
OmegaKane689
...What? Maybe if their origin was say, Europe, Asia or, Africa. If it's south of the border you can find those from Mexico all the way 1/?.
OmegaKane689
...Argentina that just traveled by land or small boat got in to the US and just stay and do there thing tell something happens. 2/2
Ashontez
Nu uh! God Emperor Trump said that its all Mexicans crossing the southern boarder!
someguyonthissite
let me just wait a month for my visa to get approved while terrorists are shooting up my house
superbob201
Calling bull. No way you'd get it in only a month.
dasklaus
A month? Legal immigration on grounds of persecution in the home country takes *years* and requires paperwork many don't have.
somepersondoingsomethings
Canada has immigration acceptance based on meritocracy. Something you'd consider evil if proposed in the US. #doublestandards.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
Domestic white Rightists have killed more people than Muslims in a america in the last decade.
hungitalianohwaitthisisntgrindr
made me laugh at you at “rightist.” you’re a joke.
chrishallett83
Damn, look at you getting downvoted for stating facts...
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someguyonthissite
source?
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
Nonsense propaganda.
MyPalmsSpaghettiKneesWeakArmsSpaghettiTheresVomitOnMySpaghetti
Relevant to this post: dumbassery like yours is a perfect example of why education is so important. Thanks for taking one for the team!
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MyPalmsSpaghettiKneesWeakArmsSpaghettiTheresVomitOnMySpaghetti
Yes, your comment thread does make us wonder...about how in the shit your ancestors dodged natural selection for millenia to produce you
PenisShapedPoops
A lot of things make me wonder, like how some people remember to breathe when they're clearly missing parts of their brain.
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
Found the rightwing nutjob.
wqpsu
wait why is it weird that people who are in favor of free movement are more likely to move around in search of opportunity?
nakedasajaybird
Because they're not brain-dead.
LiBearington
Because they are putting a conservative twist on it, for some reason.
RVA101
I thought the lady replying to CNN is satirizing conservative immigration stance. Unless that's not who you referred to when you said 'they'
TheDevilBeatJohnny
Libertarian until people they like express freedom
2graves
One of many reasons I find 97/100 libertarians very... Silly
TheDevilBeatJohnny
*dont like
TrumpLovesMeThisIKnow
For some reason? conservatives are ENTIRELY backward compared to europeans.
Euronyme
dunno why you're being downvoted. if the conservatives were in europe, they'd be a fringe, 5% party with neo nazi tendences.
LiBearington
So.. The person who tweeted this called people who are most likely for open borders conservatives?
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[deleted]
SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE
https://youtu.be/VUXXw6xr4gI