GungeWeb
129791
2967
128
Sep 6, 2020 7:16 AM
GungeWeb
129791
2967
128
NagashWasWeak
Always upvote for Norway
KleptoKea
AlamoArsenal
"Socialism" is a scare-word used to describe anything left of "Only white, male land owners can vote."
PoundSandREMF
Social programs and socialism are not the same.
1mshadowbanned
How many times do we have so sponsor right wing coups for people to realize socialism doesn't work?
spence1979
Socialism always requires willingness to make sacrifices from industry, the great ones in business. that's why you've been inoculated for...
spence1979
decades that socialism is something despicable. people tend to confuse socialism with communism.
helmutk00hl
What idiot saiz socialism never works??? If anything, it's victim of it's success. Noone would question free universal health & education
helmutk00hl
2015 the socialist party of france suggested to drop 'socialist' from it's name, cuz their goals have been achieved and are unquestioned
in2knh
So why are we becoming a nationalist country with a fascist leader?
ErniesWidow
When did socialism and liberalism become dirty words? My father was a Social Democrat since WWII.
EvilDeadTed
Since McCarthy and Nixon.
shadowex3
Socialism became a dirty word from the moment the first survivors of the gulags and the massacre of the kulaks escaped the USSR.
ErniesWidow
That was communism, not socialism.
tinyCabbage
Voters aren't afraid of socialism, they afraid of the word, because the rep party has been drilling it in them for years. The voters don't k
tinyCabbage
Now what socialism means, nor do they understand the implications, or other forms Government
RocketrySurgeon
"Other forms of government" Hell most of the time they don't even understand their own.
Afewflowers
I'm not a fan of the current plan to hand 99.9% of our wealth over to 10 people.
thehumanoidsarecoming
I genuinely feel bad for people that think corruption is endemic to any single ideology
iguanodont
What about Abstract Expressionism?
hoopsnek
iT'S A sLiPpErY SloPE!
urafunnyguysully
hoopsnek
red ones go faster
AngerySnek
Nope
junkgoof
Last generation McCarthy convinced Americans that everyone he investigated except for one or two actual spies were communist spies.
LovelyMover
Someone I work with, v.intelligent American told me socialism didn’t work ever country tried it failed...
sharievan
Well, yeah - it didn't. Social democracy in capitalism != socialism. East Germany was socialist, germany is a social democracy.
LovelyMover
It’s that some people seem to think socialism equates precisely to communism, which is all very “ughhh I really have to explain this!”
sharievan
And just like communism, non-market oriented socialist countries failed (or were coup d'etat-d by the US lol
LovelyMover
They were in need of some Freedum!
daguq
"I guess the trouble was that we didn't have any self-admitted proletarians. Everyone was a temporarily embarrassed capitalist." - Steinbeck
Tikila
Norway is capitalistic, can confirm as a norwegian. Stop using us as examples for socialism please. Socialism sucks, go capitalism!
IGetNoScopes
This. Thank you for your comment my good sir.
waitwasthatreal
Idk how many people would vote for a 25% VAT and the tax bracket effectively topping off at 70k, adding 3% after 110k.
PenisOfDeath
A tax increase for universal healthcare would save the general population more money than just having health insurance.
waitwasthatreal
Only if their employer decided to give them a substantial raise from their healthcare savings.
PenisOfDeath
https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/resources/individual-and-family/how-much-does-individual-health-insurance-cost
PenisOfDeath
Now, if you look around, you'll find that the average cost of Canadian healthcare is slightly cheaper than the average cost for American >
PenisOfDeath
> health insurance, on top of that, Canadians don't have the outrageous bills that Americans have for a hospital visit. So yes, universal >
AssSmeerf
Adopting a system from a tiny Norwegian country and applying it to the US and expecting the same results is naive.
Illinifan88
"We have very different populations!" i.e. they don't have to give these things to black and brown people there.
ibkllokh
If socialism would mean that you get free healthcare, education and social benefits, with paying taxes, is it really that bad then?
shadowex3
Ask the Ughuirs how they're liking it.
mauricereeves
Yes, I will ask the Uighurs in Norway and Iceland and Denmark and Germany how they’re liking it. Please hold.
shadowex3
Norway, Iceland, Denmark, and Germany are all 100% fully capitalist countries. Private property exists, the govt doesnt own it all.
ImGoingToEatAllYourApples
Lol, dont equate genocide with socialism
shadowex3
Name for me a socialist and/or communist state which wasn't a genocidal human rights black hole.
youcantgiveAbabybooze
It would be great, but they'd sacrifice themselves having that just so poor people don't get it too
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
Well, either that or the state program overseeing distribution starts hogging it all for themselves...
ibkllokh
Though, not sure is our system nearly perfect. There are freeriders in the system and the way I see it, it's ok. All life is valuable.
ibkllokh
The thing is, that we actually pay almost the same amount here than you. We just pay it in taxes and not in insurances.
youcantgiveAbabybooze
I'm in Scotland so I am not burdened by insurance and the threat of medical bankruptcy either
MigSelv
Yes, but then most of the money goes to the insurence companies, not healthcare...
ibkllokh
Because to be honest, looking from Finland I would be terrified of living in a country where falling on the stairs could mean bankruptcy...
waitwasthatreal
The issue is that to implement it, there would need to be substantial tax increases on the middle class, and a VAT, which is hard to sell.
ibkllokh
I totally understand this and it would be really hard to change the world today. But the way I see it, it seems that people dot even want it
junkgoof
And no more insurance premiums so savings overall. And real, available health care.
waitwasthatreal
Except that isn’t true for most people, unless their employer decides to give raises commensurate to the presumed saving, ignoring likely>>
waitwasthatreal
Tax increases they also face.
myrdrah
What is your annual health insurance and does it cover you being hospitalized for say, 6 months or longer? And will that visit be free?
ibkllokh
In Finland we don’t have insurances. And you can be hospitalized for years if needed. Everything is covered by the government with taxes.
myrdrah
Yes, I know, I thought I was commenting on an American that was complaining about taxes. Must have crossed some wires. ?
GummiBurrs
B0mb4d1l
fecking great!
TheFastpaws
Ya, whatever America. I'm trying to bail to Canada. You have fun being stuck in the past with fascists.
TheRealAlpharius
Step 1: realize that conservative thought requires this level of mental gymnastics. Step 2: stop compromising with these lunatics.
EranL
You guys have to understand americans. They know their excuses are bs. They don't a change, because they don't want to stop the exploitation
EranL
They want to become the exploiter. Americans think they're just a week away from becoming millionaires and living the good life
IWouldDoThings
Wait a sec though - I got a thing from Publishers Clearing House and it said I'm only 1 entry away from becoming a millionaire. So...
mrsidog1
So many Americans equate socialism with communism and seem afraid/lazy/indifferent to discover the truth. Sigh.
Somanyquestions
The more it goes, the more I'm amazed how Americans are scared of so so many things.
Emiloo74
It's almost like there's been a decades-long drive to cut education and create proudly ignorant citizens.
Jollybluejay4
Don’t lump us all in that generalization. I certainly hope the majority are ready for some changes
TjD1974
They should travel to the EU, Almosen all coutrys of the EU have free Healthcare etc. Way better for the ordinary perplex than the US
jery007
They're right below Canada, social democracy.
RatSolo
Most Americans are fucking stupid and have no real clue what socialism is, even those that want it
EvilDeadTed
probablyshouldbedoingwork
I think we gloss over the "red scare" in history where people were literally turning in their friends and neighbors over fears of socialism1
probablyshouldbedoingwork
It was an era of rampant paranoia and persecution that I think just frightened boomers to their core.
bigdickrick206
I'm so sad for my country. Big sigh.
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
Well, as a norwegian, we're not socialist, we're welfare capitalists, but we're branded Socialist by haters and lovers who want to argue...
mstrmrvn
And they're not even against communism! They're against fascism. I.e. Hitler. And some dont even know why...
TongueTiedLabourerfromtheLandoftheLittlePeople
They seem pretty hunky dory with Mussolini-style government so long as it seems to be on "their side"
FinnishLogic
Why only Americans? Not every last American is like this. You can find such beings in every country, who hate socialism.
TongueTiedLabourerfromtheLandoftheLittlePeople
Keep in mind the EU has more billionaires than the US.
TongueTiedLabourerfromtheLandoftheLittlePeople
Paddy here. Keep in mind the American right's "socialism" and the rest of the world socialism are two very different things.
TongueTiedLabourerfromtheLandoftheLittlePeople
For the rest of the world and academics socialism is wholly-government owned factories and farms. etc. For the American right /
TongueTiedLabourerfromtheLandoftheLittlePeople
/socialism is any form of government that doesn't involve guns, religion or sex.
TongueTiedLabourerfromtheLandoftheLittlePeople
Or black people.
BiNorwayBoy
Seems to me "Socialism" is the new "Communism" scare word over there..
?1
FractalB
Well to be fair, you should avoid communism like the plague. Or rather like something people actually avoid.
beefytrout
Conservatives always need something to be afraid of
APerfectlyNormalPieceOfToast
Most don't realise there's a difference
HellfireJags
I think anything that has to do with a functioning society scares us here in the US.
positiveleroy
GlenL
They use them interchangeably because they believe socialized education is also communism
urmomgoes2college
Ribbit
MermaidBiologist
Xenarion
Pretty much, yeah. And both are being confused with stalinism.
Trelis
The American population have been indoctrinated to fear socialism, without understanding what it is.
baltec1
Always has been
kalcaitus9000
hmmm kermit is looking good these days
IHateYouMyselfAndEveryone
Marx basically calls it the necessary, tolerable gateway to communism so I can understand their concern. Albeit misplaced.
IBuiltAFreakingArk
You're thinking antifa, that's the new scare word.
MassDriverOmega
That's a oddly detailed hand
incendiumsatus
An Australia too. This Govt is shit scared of it.
TheYodajen
I believe socialism is the cry of the ignorant
BenKrauter
Yes, I agree. But it doesnt help that many breadtubers are calling for actual socialism.
Rijtjeshuis
Socialist and Anarchist have been scare words since forever.
Xenarion
"Anarchist" has to be the most misunderstood word ever. People think it means chaos and the law of the jungle, and I guilty of that until >
Xenarion
> I started talking with actual anarchists and looking up about its true meaning.
AnyOldGame
Alotta buzzwords around lately, if you vote trump you are a white supremacist, if you vote dems you are communist. It getting stupid now.
EvilDeadTed
Dadu55
Always has been
TheGreatHelix
Niadnab
Justed filled it out. Did he write the questions?
Allrighty
This is fascism.
Xenarion
WTF?
boshbashbish
Can’t tell if memeing.
TheGreatHelix
https://action.donaldjtrump.com/post-2020-rnc-approval-poll
Xenarion
I get an "Access Denied" error. Dunno if it's because I'm in Canada.
Ngherappa
They use the terms interchangeably together with marxism.
VoidofLostKnowledge
So did the Soviet Socialist Republics behind the Iron Curtain so don't come with that nonsense.
Ngherappa
Disingenuous. Context gives words meaning. People asking for democratic socialism aren't asking for marxism, are they?
VoidofLostKnowledge
Democratic socialism is socialism without the initial violent revolution. You're pretending democratic socialism is social liberalism.
Ngherappa
...no. "Democratic socialism is a political philosophy supporting political democracy within a socially owned economy".
Cassian
So because someone else did something wrong, it's justified to keep doing it wrong?
VoidofLostKnowledge
Socialism isn't a good ideology, it exists solely to facilitate a society's move to communism. Socialism is the wrong.
FnordGallop
So, I mean, if you're reading marx (important, but out of date) you're ass backwards. Communism is a transition state to allow the creation
Cassian
To be clear, I'm not saying whether socialism (welfare) is wrong or right (it's right, scientifically proven). Just that you claim because
Cassian
That has nothing to do with what I asked :)
HerpestonMcDerping
I lived in a socialist Soviet republic and experienced communism myself. These words scare the shit out of me for good reason.
OctaviusClausewitz
I lived in a post-communist country, and that's not socialism, it's like a military junta lead by dictators and their entourage.
HerpestonMcDerping
My country wasn't a military 'El Presidente'-type junta. It was a single party socialist democracy with no private business enterprise.
OctaviusClausewitz
Yes, you dense motherfucker, that is how it was the whole eastern bloc, one dictator with his entourage leading through a one-party system.
DarksteelPenguin
I call bullshit.
HerpestonMcDerping
Why? Because you can't imagine someone not wanting to live in a shithole communist utopia?
DarksteelPenguin
No, because I don't think someone who actually experienced this would write something so fake about such a terrible experience.
HerpestonMcDerping
Inb4 "tHEy WeRe nOT reAL sOCialiSt cOuNtRiEs!!" ?
Raikupath
You're still call socialism communism. Just because they lied to you and called it socialism doesn't mean that it was socialism.
HerpestonMcDerping
I love to hear more about my country from a person who probably never saw it and has all the info Wikipedia can provide. Please, continue.
HerpestonMcDerping
You basically claim to know my country better than a person who lived in it. What does that say about you?
Marsupialmessiah
" you are still calll...." Haven't seen that one b4. Kudos, as some of you might say
BaklavaMatatas
Imagine this crazy idea: maybe not everyone on a global platform is an English native (shocking) how many languages do you speak fluently???
Raikupath
"You're still calling "is what I was trying to say. I forgot to add "ing" but it seems like enough people knew what I was trying to say.
DarkUranium
Many people who lived in a socialist *non*-Soviet republic (Yugoslavia, which was *actually* socialist) are nostalgic for it around here.
armandraynal
Even the Russians are nostalgic of the USSR. Current statistics and the 1991 soviet referendum shows it.
armandraynal
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nostalgia_for_the_Soviet_Union#Polling
armandraynal
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_Soviet_Union_referendum
HerpestonMcDerping
That's for another reason. They lived in a parasitic empire existing at the expense of a dozen slave-countires. Of course they want it back.
DaSauceSeeker
Diversion tactic. It's so later they can pull a: "Would you rather "Communism" or "Socialism"?" Counting on the negative stigma of socialism
GrumpyOldMillennial
Idk. Communism is far worse than socialism. Like, by far. America has a bunch of good socialism, we just want more equitable amounts.
ADegenFromUpcountry
I can assure you, you don’t.
Cassian
I don't think you know what communism is =/ I'm guessing you're thinking 'authoritarian state-capitalism' like China or USSR
GrumpyOldMillennial
You are right. There never has been true communism so, I guess I mean, 'Socialism is better than the PRACTICAL application of communism."
Cassian
Still wrong in multiple ways, but upvote for at least trying to be rational and self-critical about it
Xenarion
Yeah, that's stalinism. People often associate the two, mostly because country to claim to be communists aren't.
WinoCrimesand69s
Communism is an ideal that cant happen literally. Human nature is too individual will based to give up its ambition for more
Cassian
Any source or study or anything that supports that premise?
TheFlyingBokChoy
I mean Marxist communism does REQUIRE a violent political overthrow of the upper class.
Cassian
Not really. It'd probably be necessary in our CURRENT society, but no, not inevitably.
IGetNoScopes
Norway is not socialist, its a hybrid of capitalism and socialism. Pure socialism has never worked in the history of the world. 1/
IGetNoScopes
Norway is a small country relative to the US and doesn't have the same complexities as the US. Its not as easy as you think. We still 2/
IGetNoScopes
need business and startups for the economy to thrive. Going socialism is not the way to go. You may deny it buy America has 3/
IGetNoScopes
The BEST doctors and universities in the world. America still is the best country to live in if you want to be any sort of professional. 4/
IGetNoScopes
Imgur has a high left bias so I see why socliasm gets promoted on here. But Americans don't realize it, but if you are someone who is 5/
IGetNoScopes
highly motivated and wants to get ahead in life, there is no other country like the US where you have so many opportunities to succeed. 6/