Everyonesfavorite
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Marcellus Williams is scheduled to be executed tomorrow evening. Please call the missourri gop pos Gov.Mike Parsons office and ask for a pardon. Office of Governor Michael L. Parson PO Box 720 Jefferson City, MO 65102 Phone: (573) 751-3222 Fax: (573) 751-1495
Set the innocent man free!!
Can we save a life?? Let's do this (better than saving a fn fetus)
Sorry, not the best article, there are several out there. Search Marcellus Williams and you'll find them.
OnFridaysWeWearBeskar
His DNA not on the weapon doesn't prove his innocence. He could have worn gloves What evidence DID prove his guilt in the trial? Focusing on the weapon while no source with information on the actual cause of conviction seems suspicious.
ImurevJourhein
I know I sound like the bad guy here, but he's going to die. Unjustly. And when/if it turns out he was innocent, all involved will shrug their shoulders and say something to the effect of 'he could have done it'.
Sparing his life could lead to his innocence being proven, which would mean restitution for wrongful imprisonment, and worse yet for Missouri- letting a black man live.
hadoken77101
Gov mailbox vm is full
charley5
Missouri is a fucked up state.
nojustsayitdont
What was a reporter doing in his home? I'm assuming not his wife yes? What was the murder weapon, and why should we assume DNA should be on it? So many questions. Guess I'll have to go search the case up.
CrimsonShortOne
Jesus fucking Christ, how is capital punishment still a thing. No one should be put to death for any reason. I don't care if the person is a mass murderer, who was caught in the middle of the act, if one innocent person is killed, it's too many.
Khanamana324
Republicans have a serious boner for state sanctioned torture and murder.
HollerinAtTheVoid
This isn't even all that partisan of an issue. My 1st (very conservative & from Louisiana) step-father was staunchly against the death penalty. This is how he told me why: "As a prosecutor, I definitely had innocent people receive guilty verdicts at my hand. Because it was my job and I legally didn't have another choice. Then as a defense attorney, I won cases for people who I knew were guilty and needed to be in jail. Because it was my job and I legally didn't have another choice."
Everyonesfavorite
Painful truth right there.
Szavor
Supreme Court refused to intervene.
wienerdogsftw
his skin color is enough to kill him in that shithole state
dizzyturtle
Dang, even the original prosecuting attorneys think he should be let out. Don't hear that often.
jaimeeleigh44
You can email too! https://innocenceproject.org/petitions/call-gov-parson-to-stop-the-sept-24-execution-of-marcellus-williams-417-373-3400/
IhopeyougetstageIIIcoloncancer
I'm vehemently against the death penalty on principle (the cost of keeping someone in prison for life is what we as a society must pay for failing ourselves), but instances where it might hypothetically be enacted should be 100% beyond a shadow of a doubt. I'm talking the perpetrator recording themselves confessing at the scene of the crime while presenting two-factor authentication.
57rescraft9
So the lady that was stabbed, had her purse and husband's computer stolen, and his girlfriend saw both in his car and he sold the computer a couple days later. What say you??
Everyonesfavorite
Her family also doesn't want him executed.
pandagrrl
I can't be the only one who read Marcellus Wallace.
Thewayofthebear
usernametakenisthestoryofmylife
If there's no proof, then what are they doing?
melmboundanddown
There is evidence, plenty. And his then girlfriend confirmed he had stolen the same missing jacket and laptop, and his cellmate said he admitted to it and could share details. Just the dna evidence seems messed up because first responders touched knife without gloves. Shouldn't have death penalty anyway because it's never 100% sure. Her family don't want death penalty.
ChanceVLuck
Yeah, NO. Please read what I've attached before even considering making a call. https://murderpedia.org/male.W/w/williams-marcellus.htm#google_vignette
Mec26
Most people,including the prosecutor, admit that evidence was bungled and the guy didn’t do it. In fact e DNA exonerates him.
mycatpoopedinmyshoe
Thank you for posting this. I hope more people read this….
InsanityOnTheInternet
Yeah, no I'll take DNA evidence over some guys blog post.
Mec26
We can read that blof post but also the many many articles talking about the evidence regarding his innocence.
thechelonianshelmet
https://innocenceproject.org/who-is-marcellus-williams-man-facing-execution-in-missouri-despite-dna-evidence-supporting-innocence/
Nuraalek
Yeah, NO. If he's truely guilty then let him serve time in prison. The death penalty is barbaric, no civilised nation uses it now.
ShiftingPattern
@op - Begging you or someone else to steal my playbook since I am slammed by my professional life today; the last time this happened I had a lot more free time. Last time, I found out the governor's church, called the pastor, and begged the pastor to call the governor saying I was moved by God to save an innocent man. I can't ever know if I actually made a difference, but he promised to call and the man on death row was spared.
ShiftingPattern
I'm ignoring a call I'm on and googling, but I won't be able to make the outbound call myself. The church in question is the First Baptist Church in Bolivar, Missouri. Senior pastor Adam Hughes but ideally we'll need someone who was working there before Parsons took up residence in the Governor's Mansion. I'd likely try Bret Stanford (Worship Pastor). Trying to find a good phone number for both actively.
ShiftingPattern
Senior Pastor is supposedly: (218) 242-1681 but I have low confidence in this one because the source was muddling info between two people.
ShiftingPattern
(I'm literally on an all-day call trying to put out a major fire with one of our larger customers. I am rarely speaking, but I am on video.)
ShiftingPattern
Possible phone numbers for Bret Stanford (417 number is likely the best bet):
417-326-6813
573-518-0118
618-377-4462
ShiftingPattern
If calling, BE RESPECTFUL. Be polite. If anyone asks where you got the number ("I was moved by God and the internet just seemed to bring me to you."). Stress that this is about preventing an evil act and saving an innocent man.
ShiftingPattern
Phone number for the church in general: +1 (417) 326-2431
psmith00
they'll admit their mistake after he's been executed.
tidepool
It’s cheaper to say you’re sorry than to pay them reparations for false imprisonment.
SomeJoeGuy
Typically in these cases they'll issue an apology and admit their mistake only after all of the embarrassed parties are dead.
WellIfIHaveTo
The original prosecutor has already publicly changed their position on the case.
Ionico
We don't know if he's innocent. THAT BEING SAID... I am against the death penalty. And especially with questions still unanswered. I say call the governor, and explain why the death penalty is wrong. +1
PandAnomoly
I used to be for the death penalty, but as I've gotten older and seen so many instances where our justice system has fucked up, I'm pretty strongly against it now.
Skuggen
We don't have to know he's innocent. If we don't know he's guilty, he should go free. That's how it's supposed to work.
Clockworkdancerobot
https://innocenceproject.org/who-is-marcellus-williams-man-facing-execution-in-missouri-despite-dna-evidence-supporting-innocence/
Everyonesfavorite
Please use the # i posted as it is a direct line, and not the (legit) line from innocent project patching you through (their own call center). Thanks for posting this link though!! That's how I learned about his case previously.
conniecpu
When the original prosecutor now believes he's innocent that's pretty fucking good sign he's innocent
Fairemont
Yeah, but he's black in a state where it's not good to be black, so it won't matter what anyone does at this point. Innocent or not, enough of the wrong people are happy he will die.
Everyonesfavorite
I agree with your "call the gov..." Please know that:
There was none of his DNA evidence on the weapon. He was found guilty based on testimony by someone granted immunity and PAID $5,000. FOR THEIR testament. WTF.
Narwhilian
Also the prosecutor for his case admitted to racial bias in the trial and filed to vacate his conviction and sentence. Pretty sure if the guy who got the conviction is saying it's wrong there might be some fucking reasonable doubt
Ionico
Ya that sounds messed up, I'll check out the case and make a call myself.
Clockworkdancerobot
Innocent till proven guilty. "There is no reliable evidence proving that Marcellus Williams committed the crime for which he is scheduled to be executed on Sept. 24. The State destroyed or corrupted the evidence that could conclusively prove his innocence and the available DNA and other forensic crime-scene evidence does not match him. "
Ionico
I understand, you must let me check for myself and verify anything I read here today, and if it checks out, you have my support. We must respect people's right, and frankly obligation to verify information they read online before they act on it.
Clockworkdancerobot
It's just "we don't know if he's innocent" was a bit bad to jump in with when you didn't know the case at all.
Maxgaap
I agree that the eye witness testimony is unreliable, and this is further compounded by incentives a witness may have received. But the lack of DNA on the murder weapon is in no way exculpatory. Any expectation that every criminal conviction will be accompanied by the accused's DNA everywhere is a ridiculous CSI syndrome expectation
echoawoo
If there's DNA present that isn't the victim or his, that's a pretty solid indicator.
Maxgaap
Not necessarily. If someone is stabbed in a kitchen where multiple people had access to a knife there are chances that multiple other people's fingerprints and DNA are present on that knife. That doesn't prove they are murderers in the same way a lack of someone's fingerprints would mean someone hadn't used it to commit a murder.
Maxgaap
That being said while from a moral perspective I don't necessarily disagree with the principle of the death penalty I do not believe the government is competent enough, nor the trial system perfect enough for it to be administered by the courts.
Thesaya
There will never be a government or system able to guarantee no innocent people are ever executed.
Maxgaap
I don't believe the bifurcation of the sentencing phase for the application of the death penalty is adequate. The cost of being wrong is infinitely high. And the actual monetary cost of a death penalty trial is too high to continue the use of the death penalty in my opinion. Plus the decision to seek it is left up to a district attorney who is an elected official is another reason not to do it. A capricious decision because someone is up for re-election is too arbitrary for taking a life
taez555
It's crazy that we execute innocent people in the United States.
OhIfIMust
Even the fucking PROSECUTOR is trying to get him cleared.
GirrusDah
Yeah, there's a global initiative called the innocence project where they get college students to work on these cases to create appeals. (Well not quite sure how global it is but it's at least in some Irish universities.)
retrostone21
Edit: remove innocent
DJOldguy
We've always done it... but Republicunts don't fucking care... as long as someone pays. Especially if they are not white.
HandoB4Javert
B166ERMaximus
You had me at “It’s crazy that we execute innocent people” … but then you lost me at “in the United States.”
ballsoutflyer
"I'd rather have a guilty man go free than to kill an inn--" yeah, can't finish that. Just put it on the pile.
TheOnlyPtylerdactyl
Talked to a relative who's a typical low-info right wing guy about this kinda thing. He was going on about the death penalty. My argument was, do you, yourself, *really* trust the government to never ever be wrong and have the power to kill people regardless of their incompetence? He stopped and had a thought for a minute, legit had never occurred to him before
Ikwilstroopwaffels
Its crazy we execute ANYONE. This is not the fucking dark ages,
Neednoggle
It's crazy that you execute guilty people too, and by means easily considered torture.
taez555
Hell, the US is still temporarily holding people in Guantanamo Bay Cuba captured 23 years ago, and still hasn't charged them with a crime... They haven't even had a chance yet to prove their guilt or innocence in court. Any day now.
Tom4te
If I remember correctly the rate for wrongly convicted inmates on death row in the US seats somewhere close to 8 % historically.
MrWolfwood
Always have, always will. Poor, black, immigrant etc. are all valid reasons for the police to arrest and kill a person.
Ffudmethen
Not really we live in a shit hole of a country
Quessir
Seems par for the course, really. The country is insane.
LoudBirb
If you have a death penalty, you will inevitably execute innocent people. There is no such thing as a system without error, and in this case the error is an innocent person murdered by the state.
Chievestevenbouigon
And super not surprising that many people who are pro-life are pro death penalty. They see zero irony in that
whiskeywonka
Have to keep them inline somehow
alt86er
Actually, it's totally predictable that such a shit show would happen in the US.
Mehtoes
Agreed!!
taez555
Happen, happens, happened, continues to happen, has been happening....
Melonfish
Whilst I'm not convinced of his guilt, or innocence. With the information provided there's reasonable doubt, he absolutely should not be on death row.
ballsoutflyer
We already know why he's really there.
FlowerIsland
Sounds about white.
ballsoutflyer
Everyonesfavorite
It's *wrong* that we execute innocent people in the US
unluckyandbored
It's wrong that we execute ANYONE in the US. As deeply flawed as our legal system is, as horrifically corrupt as so many of the people in it are, NOBODY should be facing death for any crime.
taez555
It's crazy that we execute people in the United States.
Everyonesfavorite
I agree! What happened to the idea of rehabilitation and making people in prison capable of being productive members of society?
Outlavv
Doesnt work
Sticklebrickk
Because the prison system is too effective
NoNameFred
Oh, that's easy: it's something that didn't really get going until after the American Revolution. Most of the rest of the world swapped over, but the USA decided they didn't want to copy what the British were up to…
THEmichaelscarn12
taez555
Those ideals never really took hold in the United States.
Everyonesfavorite
Yes. Its sad because the US was never trying to "fix" the situation, only to remove people from a public vicinity.
INeverReadTheTOS
What happened to "beyond a reasonable doubt"?
autofire
That assumes people can be reasonable
somethingsomethingwittyhere
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/12/opinion/when-innocence-is-no-defense.html
BigRobbo
If the system admits to putting innocent men on death row, it means they admit the system is broken.
Corduroyrockhopper
He's black. Sadly for a lot of people, that's enough.
UprootedGrunt
From what I remember, he was convicted around 20 years ago, so that level was met *at that time*. But now there's DNA evidence exonerating him, the prosecutor has asked for the conviction to be vacated, and the judge considered it and said "nah".
itrytoonlysaypositivethings
Too few angry men, it's gotta be at least 12.
RaySkye
It went away when the SCROTUS decided that being innocent is not a good enough reason to be released from prison.
allyrounds365
It is beyond a reasonable doubt that he is black. I have a suspicion that he is reasonably poor. It seems to be a fact he is in the south. What more proof could anyone need?
Lurch1911
Either state did a good job of proving it without dna, or his defense attorney sucked ass
sirava
Jones v Hendrix
Not really relevant to this case as far as I know, but that's the one where the supreme Court said innocence isn't enough of a defense because of a technicality.
OverthinkingThis
And then you get into the whole batshit insane legislative pitfall that you need to present new evidence to call for a retrial/re-examination. So if you are screwed by misconduct or misrepresentation of evidence you can't cite that bogus evidence (or lack of evidence) for retrial. You have to somehow generate new evidence. In jail. For a crime you didn't commit. It's fucking insane.
hwatL4bloopy
Didn't someone create a loophole by shipping their blood out and having it present during a minor crime?
OverthinkingThis
I haven't personally heard of this but you'd need to connect it to the original crime somehow afaik. But I'm sure even stranger stuff has been tried.
hwatL4bloopy
I don't think it was used to connect to the crime itself but to say that DNA can be found in strange places. I need to see if I can remember enough details to Google this
Bollramm
Wait what?
flashboredom
s://thehill.com/opinion/judiciary/4072314-supreme-court-injustice-legal-innocence-is-not-enoughhttps://thehill.com/opinion/judiciary/4072314-supreme-court-injustice-legal-innocence-is-not-enough/
http/">https://thehill.com/opinion/judiciary/4072314-supreme-court-injustice-">s">/">https://thehill.com/opinion/judiciary/4072314-supreme-court-injustice-legal-innocence-is-not-enough/
https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-supreme-court-just-said-in-in-shinn-v-ramirez-that-evidence-of-innocence-is-not-enough
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/12/opinion/when-innocence-is-no-defense.html
For more:
https://www.google.com/search?q=innocence%20is%20not%20a%20defense
Bollramm
And they call this a 'justice' system???
flashboredom
https://www.vera.org/news/why-we-say-criminal-legal-system-not-criminal-justice-system
ShieldAnvil1
Trials will always be jury of humans, there is nothing reasonable about humans. The best argument for ending the death penalty as we are by our nature prone to making mistakes. It is better not to kill a guilty man if the price is we might kill an innocent one. “Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them?”
Hyo38
in his trial it was an all white jury aside form one person.
Einbrecher
Lifetime imprisonment is also significantly cheaper than execution.
SamuthNBS
This is why juries are instructed to consider if the case is beyond reasonable doubt, and why judges should request a unanimous verdict.
miraclemaxcoc
I disagree. The best interest of the public at large is served by lifetime imprisonment rather than the enormously expensive capital punishment process. Which also does a great job of making sure an innocent person is never executed.
ShieldAnvil1
You disagree with what? humans make errors or you that you should spare a guilty man if there is risk he innocent? or if you disagree with the "best argument" line, what a weird thing to quibble about, if it is not the best reason it is still a very good reason. Sub "True but also" for "I disagree" and you form an Allie rather tan starting off with a confrontation.
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whiskeywonka
Son aint nobody got the time to enumerate that list.
flarflarf
"but holy fuck, if there's doubt, you can't kill the dude." I think you will find that the state of Missouri has in the past, will in the future and absolutely will kill an innocent man here in the present.
GenXHippie
That’s a big question, friend.
shameofslate
“What the fuck is wrong with the US?”
How much time do you have?
SupaPat
KKK state and black guy, checks out for murica
LtRooney
Would you like the answer chronologically or alphabetically?
BANANAFLAKE
Well, you see, unfortunately he was found guilty of being black.
RUFingKiddingMe
Did you read the link? I don't have a reasonable doubt. Fuck this dude
usernameusedinlessplatforms2
Scene didn't have his DNA, but had someone elses DNA. U dont think that the DNA at murder scene could be the murderers DNA?
LoudBirb
I did. The original prosecutor that got him put on death row has admitted to racial bias in the trial and filed to vacate his conviction and sentence. If the prosecutor has a reasonable doubt, you absolutely should as well: https://innocenceproject.org/who-is-marcellus-williams-man-facing-execution-in-missouri-despite-dna-evidence-supporting-innocence/
ValleyFur
I mean, even the prosecutor isn’t sure. https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/23/us/marcellus-williams-missouri-supreme-court-hearing?cid=ios_app
Rogahar
You are right, but you see, he made the unfortunate mistake of being born Not White, so an entirely different set of laws actually applies to him (aka whichever ones justify the criminal justice system in that area treating him like less than human garbage to try and validate their racist beliefs.)
SerialChickenLover
The jury probably decided that it has no reasonable doubt that a black man should die. That’s it.
Ionico
We don't know if he's innocent. But unfortunately it's going to take a pardon from the governor to avoid the death penalty. That's why we need to be careful with (I wish we could abolish) the death penalty. It's final, and only a pardon can save you from it, leaving people to question if they are setting a murderer free.
ValleyFur
And the pardon cannot come after the sentenced punishment takes place. Justice will always be imperfect. And an imperfect system cannot result in absolutes.
neithermenoryou
There is a evidence that he is innocent, there's a confession of racial bias during the trial from the prosecutor themselves, the only testimonies during the trial were from two people that got incentives to implicate Mr Williams, it's a lot of things that add up and have been brushed aside carelessly by the system.
https://innocenceproject.org/who-is-marcellus-williams-man-facing-execution-in-missouri-despite-dna-evidence-supporting-innocence/
Everyonesfavorite
Aaaand he served (iirc) 20yrs already!!!
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LtRooney
For having nothing to do with the crime in question?
DSREX
Based on his claims that are backed by forensic science, he is not the killer and should not have served any time. But they will kill him anyway because the system is fucked and it does not serve justice.
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Unicorngamingbutts365
Reading is fundamental. You don’t know the case you should sit in the corner and mind your business
jamiedBreaker
If you don't care, then keep your mouth shut to begin with. How bored can you possibly be to have an opinion and say out loud that you don't even care to research it? It's not about some new trend or product, it's a person's life, ffs.
neithermenoryou
You might want to read on the case then, because the conviction was mostly because he was black, literally, without hyperbole.
https://innocenceproject.org/who-is-marcellus-williams-man-facing-execution-in-missouri-despite-dna-evidence-supporting-innocence/
Narwhilian
Kinda wild to see someone advocate for a life sentence and follow it up with "I don't know the case nor do I care"
Also enough for a conviction means VERY LITTLE in the American legal system. Especially when the defendant is black and doubly so in states like Missouri