ShouldersDeepInAHorse
208722
6892
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Today might just be another day for 99.93 percent of the world. But to a miniscule percent, in the small country of Norway, today marks the 7th anniversary of the worst terrorist attack ever put upon this country. Put together by one man aiming to change the entire political world of Norway through violence.
The July 22. attacks were two sequential terrorist attacks, commited by Anders Behring Breivik, a domestic terrorist and extremist right winger, who aimed to send a message to what he believed to be the two main enemies of Norway, the labor party and the religion of Islam.
The first attack occured in Oslo's governmental center, a city block of 9 political buildings, all important to the politcal activity of Norway. Breivik parked a car containing a fertilizer bomb weighting 950 kilograms, or in excess of 2 000 pounds near the prime minister's office. The bomb exploded few minutes after he left the car and killed 8 people, and injured an excess of 30 people, as well as damaging multiple political departments and the prime minister's office.
Two hours later, Breivik arrived at Utøya in Tyrifjorden, where the Labor party's youth array (AUF) were arranging their summer camp. Disguised as a policeman, Breivik opened fire on teachers and students with a machine gun, killing 66, of which 33 were below the age of 18, and injuring 66 more. The prime minister, Jens Stoltenberg had been planning a surprise visit to the island one day after the attack to hold a speech for the Labor party's camp. Breivik's attack continued for an hour, before he was arrested by the Hønefoss Police.
The attacks, including victims who died later due to injuries, killed 78 people, and injured an excess of 300 people.
During interrogation Breivik admitted to what he called "Gruesome, but necessary actions" But did not admit to Criminal activity. His motivations were to display his vision of Western Europe to the world, through his Manifesto: "2083 - A European Declaration of Independence" released online a few hours before his attacks, of which the Ideological content was both extremist-right and millitant, and showcased his view that Norway's two biggest enemies were the labor party and the religion of Islam, both of which he aimed to throttle the recruiting of with his attack.
Under trial, it was deemed that Breivik did not suffer from psychosis, and was fully aware and consciouss of his actions during his months of planning. He is currently serving a 21 year sentence (The highest Norwegian law will allow outside crimes of war.) in Skien prison, under heavy psychological surveillance
In the end however, Breivik lost. His attack did not change the political world of Norway, or laws to either Laborers or Islamists, the Norwegian people do not cover in fear over him, and the only hate he succeeded in spreading was that against himself and his message.
"We are still shaken by what his us, but we will NEVER give up our values. Our answer is even more democracy, more openness and more humanity. But never naivety." -Jens Stoltenberg, Norway's prime minister. (2011)
To any fellow Norwegians, those who might've known the poor faces above, or those unfortunate enough to share a last name with them, my heart goes out to you. The biggest respect we can pay them is to honor their memory, and show them that the actions of one hatefull man will not ruin our country.
In loving memory of those who were taken from us too early, by the hands of hatred and bigroty:
Mona Abdinur Age:18
Ismail Haji Ahmed Age:19
Thomas Margido Antonsen Age:16
Porntip Ardam Age:21
Modupe Ellen Awoyemi Age:15
Lene Maria Bergum Age:19
Kevin Daae Berland Age:15
Trond Berntsen Age:51
Sverre Flåte Bjørkavåg Age:28
Torjus Jakobsen Blattmann Age:17
Carina Borgund Age:18
Johannes Buø Age:14
Monica Elisabeth Bøsei Age:45
Åsta Sofie Helland Age:16
Sondre Furseth Dale Age:17
Monica Iselin Didriksen Age:18
Gizem Dogan Age:17
Andreas Edvardsen Age:18
Tore Eikeland Age:21
Bendik Rosnæs Ellingsen Age:18
Hanne Marie Orvik Endresen Age:61
Aleksander Aas Eriksen Age:16
Andrine Bakkene Espeland Age:16
Hanne Anette Balch Fjalestad Age:43
Silje Merete Age:17
Hanne Kristine Age:19
Andreas Dalby Age:17
Snorre Haller Age:30
Kai Hauge Age:32
Rune Havdal Age:43
Ingrid Berg Heggelund Age:18
Ida Marie Hill Age:34
Karin Elena Holst Age:15
Anne Lise Holter Age:51
Eivind Hovden Age:15
Guro Vartdal Håvoll Age:18
Jamil Rafal Mohamad Jamil Age:20
Steinar Jessen Age:16
Maria Maagerø Johannesen Age:17
Ronja Søttar Johansen Age:17
Espen Jørgensen Age:17
Sondre Kjøren Age:17
Margrethe Bøyum Age:16
Syvert Knudsen Age:17
Tove Åshill Knutsen Age:56
Anders Kristiansen Age:18
Jon Vegard Lervåg Age:32
Elisabeth Trønnes Lie Age:16
Gunnar Linaker Age:23
Tamta Lipartelliani Age:23
Eva Kathinka Lütken Age:17
Hanne Ekroll Løvlie Age:30
Even Flugstad Malmedal Age:18
Tarald Kuven Mjelde Age:18
Ruth Benedichte Vatndal Age:15
Emil Okkenhaug Age:15
Diderik Aamodt Olsen Age:19
Henrik André Pedersen Age:27
Rolf Christopher Johansen Age:25
Karar Mustafa Qasim Age:19
Bano Abobakar Rashid Age:18
Henrik Rasmussen Age:18
Ida Beathe Rogne Age:17
Synne Røyneland Age:18
Kjersti Berg Age:26
Marianne Sandvik Age:16
Fredrik Lund Schjetne Age:18
Lejla Selaci Age:17
Birgitte Smetbak Age:15
Isabel Victoria Green Age:17
Silje Stamneshagen Age:18
Victoria Stenberg Age:17
Tina Sukuvara Age:18
Sharidyn Svebakk-Bøhn Age:14
Simon Sæbø Age:18
Håvard Vederhus Age:21
Håkon Ødegaard Age:17
If you have read this far, thank you so, so much. It means more than you think. This was to Norway what 9.11 were to you Americans, even as I write this I can hear the local churchbell ring as people gather to mourn the losses of almost a hundred people. Thank you for your time, I hope I didn't ruin your mood for the day with this story.
FP:EDIT Oh my god guys Front page!? This means a lot to me, when I first began to socialize online I realized a lot of my american friends had never heard of this attack, of course I don't blame anyone, Norway is a tiny tiny country, half the size of Texas with a fifth of the population of just that one state, so helping to spread the word of this awful incident means a lot to me. I understand that a post like this will inherently spark a lot of political comments and opinions, but I ask of you to please keep it classy, In the end this is not a post meant to discuss the details of terror laws or prison terms, but a way to remember the most significant incident in modern Norwegian history.
Apart from that, uuhh... Send boobs! I like the huge ones. Every comment gets upvoted! Even if you slam your head into the keyboard, points for all!
guerrillafish
The north remembers
killersoda275
I remember driving past utøya going home from summer break two day after. It was super rainy, and I just remember Hearses parked everywhere.
dolphindeepinahorse
Porntip Ardam
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
This post aims to respect and mourn the victims, nothing else... but when we're in private we can giggle at that... and prepare for hell..
AleksanderLehti
It is the worst terrorist attack in the Nordic countries. Carried out by a right wing extremist, not by a Muslim. The real threat comes /1
AleksanderLehti
/2 from within our borders. Not from the refuges. Most attacks are carried out by neo-Nazis and right wing extremists.
EmergencyMouse
I moved to Norway 2 weeks after this happened. Sharing in the grief of a nation was heartbreaking, but no one ever excluded me. 1/2
EmergencyMouse
Your nation welcomed an immigrant as a friend, and for that I will be forever awed and grateful. 2/2
mcopal
You can never ruin somone's day with a heartfelt tribute to loved ones lost in a senseless act. Thks for telling those of us who didn't know
ohbutwhy
Vi glömmer aldrig ?
philosophocles
❤ Canada sends its love. We have to stand up for decency in this time of political bullshittery.
R0asted
Thank you for making this post. I lost more than I care to explain on that fateful day 7 years ago. Tusen takk.
FujoshiBabe
I remember this day
barnwolf
Before this post I didn't know the names of any of the victims, but I knew his name and why he did it.
ithadtobesaidapparently
Mitt lille land Et lite sted, en håndfull fred Slengt ut blant vidder og fjord
bandero94
Ole Paus og Maria Mena :(
garyeffing
“More democracy, more openness, more humanity...” hear hear.
HerrFraeulein
This is an incredibly mature response to this horrible attack.
toasteheh
1) As a Norwegian: his actions were a result of less democracy and openness with regard to Norwegian politics. Not defending his actions and
toasteheh
2) I absolutely despise the man.
Syrmerlin
Just a reminder that there are people in high political office who share his ideology. They demonize the other and all who won't join them.
BlacksMcNutt
Just like the democrats do
doesntmatter
Only a Sith deals in absolutes
kipagami
I remember this story. I am glad to hear your country healed but still honors their memories.
Bolster
The people that survived are getting death threats , still to this day. Threats saying «he» did nothing wrong and a bullet is waiting on’em
lyricallove
That is so fucking terrible for them. :( I can't imagine how they cope with that shit.
HellBrendy
Norway is in a much darker place now than before, and claiming we healed and has gotten better is a lie.Even our ministers r nourishing hate
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
The youngest one was fuicking 14 man... we never forget, not this.
alpacasaurusrex
I’m so used to this shit in America that I almost swiped past this but then read it and was like “fuck why didn’t we hear about this!?!” I’m
BlackTabbie
There was information about this in the USA when it happened, but I'm not sure how widespread it was. I ended up reading about it much later
alpacasaurusrex
so sorry for you all. And am shamed I almost swiped past it because I’m just so used to it/numbed. This was very moving.
IMJ64
Were are you from?
alpacasaurusrex
USA. Between all the shootings and random bombings we constantly have its like “another one?”
brassknucklenerd
Sometimes the dimmest bulbs go out with the biggest flash.
iostream64
The thing that these retarded radicals do not realize is that by doing things like this they only martyr their opponents.
malachilenomade
So to attack the labor party and muslims, he killed mostly teenagers...
MrsDreadful
He attacked the labor party's teen summer camp...
doesntmatter
The Labour party's youth club. Iirc he reasoned that they were "future of the Labour party" and targeted them because of that
tzap
Not completely unsound. I think what Breivik also hoped was to promote violence in politics. Unfortunately he hasn't yet lost that fight.
effinamazing
I remember this day like it was yesterday; we were celebrating my lil'sisters birthday, and the whole family was there, but when my 1/?
effinamazing
Uncle from Oslo arrived he said that something was happening in Oslo, the tv got turned on, and all the grownups where gathered in the 2/?
effinamazing
Tv room, glued to the tv. The live views from the bombing was horrible. Even worse was when the rumor about something else started to 3/?
effinamazing
Surface, so many of the kids tried to call the police, but not all of them came trough, so they sent messages on facebook, twitter 4/?
effinamazing
We knew something was happening, but not what. And then the numbers started pouring in, up in the hundreds, teenages dead. Horrible.
NorwegianGlaswegian
It was a confusing and horrible time. I heard the bomb go off when visiting a family friend in Holmen. Thought it was thunder since there 1/
TheNudeJumper
He admitted to listening to techno music through head phones so the screams wouldn’t change his mind during the massacre. Horrifying.
WhereIsTheChocolateMilkEmoji
I watched a BBC documentary that said when he got on the island he was listening to Lux Aeterna
TheNudeJumper
Yeah I may have misspoke. I watched the same doc.
kahdri
That'd certainly fit his narcissism and self-inflated importance.
dajustifier
We have to call it by its name, white radical Christian terrorism.
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
Thank you. I hate it when people throw names like Nazi and KKK around without regard for definitons, historical accuracy is important.
dajustifier
Most people don't know the actual definition of Fascism, I bet you don't. I didn't until a few years ago.
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
FASCISM IS WHAT EVERY ONE WHO VOTED TRUMP IS TRYING TO FORCE ON MUSLIMS AND THAT'S WHY WE HAVE TO KILL THEM. -The internet, probably.
dajustifier
Trump has no ideology though his puppet masters are dragging us to Theocratic Fascism. Some voted for him for economic reasons which were BS
bishops
No matter how much you hate islam or a different political party that's not a way to show it...
TanDumpLord
Thank you so much for this post, from someone who was personally affected. Never forget the names of the people we tragically lost that day.
W0ND0
Do you mind to share how it affected you, given you are really okay with it? Otherwise, please ignore my question. Thank you!
TanDumpLord
Lost a pretty close friend of mine. I'd rather not share any names, if that's okay! I've been a part of AUF for quite some time!
Kuvajainen
Thank you for sharing and sorry for your loss!
W0ND0
Sorry to hear this, thank you for sharing. All the best!
sewrowhaywaythebeginning
I was going to make a political comment but I can't. I just hope I'll never forget these people.
AgolfHiller
I'll help. And it all happened because of Trump and russian hackers!
simiotic24
The comment really makes itself
FinnishThem
Wasn't a machine gun, it was a semi-auto M14 style rifle.
nnngh
Ruger Mini 14, to be exact.
CaribouNuggets
Mini 14 = .223 cal. M14 = .308 cal.
Radix865
Nuh-uh, it was a AR style AK-47 Glock assault rifle with the chainsaw attachment!
JimJonesKoolAidSurvivor
They need to outlaw those. The chainsaw is too much testosterone
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
It's unfair that they ban those but still legalize the dildo crossbows with nightvision though.
computerphile
He wasn't apprehended by Hønefoss police either. Beredskapstroppen Delta (Oslo) did.
JustinLeu
Homocide machine, there you guys happy now?
ImgursLibertarian
That could be a BMW or paint can.
BoredLyron
Not sure if the typo is intentional or not. Changes how you read the message quite a bit...
CaribouNuggets
Everything's a machine gun to people who know shit about firearms.
ImALagomorphSam
I don't know that the subtle difference mattered to his victims.
MeAnd2Bs
Of course not, but it made a difference as to how many people were killed.
Slasher2977
Calling something a machine gun merely makes it scarier. It's a fear tactic and besides that is wrong.
noekult
I'm a carguy, people make mistakes about car stuff all day long,doesn't mean I need to act like I'm better. Same goes for firearms mistakes.
Terminology
This. I own guns and roll my eyes whenever someone thinks they're smarter than others because they know the diff between a mag and clip.
MeAnd2Bs
But there's nothing wrong with educating people.
Terminology
Very true, but there's a difference between educating and arrogance because someone doesn't know particulars about your area of interest.
ljnumber8
I don’t use this lightly, but what a cunt.
Comet260
He considers Muslims terrorists, yet launches his own terrorist attack.....
CondescendingCunt
Fuck you too, bro.
NiceGreenArrows
Yeah, you're much better than him.
IMayOrMayNotHaveTroubleFindingAndOrChoosingAUsername
Aye, a right cunt, and not in the Australian sense of the word.
ImmaNeedBoutTreeFiddy
We still call dickheads cunts. This guy is a right fucking dipshit headed cunt tho.
mrtinyman
He also recently complained about being treated unfairly. Cunt has a PS 3, cable TV and an access to any book he wants in a huge library.
IUpvoteEveryNicholasCageGIF
He's a cunt with Blue Waffle
Gentlemanriot
That would imply pleasurable depth and warmth..
CrazychrisX
Norwegian jails are like a 6 star hotel..
Minergiii
Norway also has one of the lowest crime rates in the world.
CBSxHalverx
I heard he was complaining that his allowance wasn’t high enough and wanted more PlayStation games. Talk about a rough 21 year sentence
[deleted]
[deleted]
Godsoftheodds
Hoooooo boy. That's some dark dark shit. Funny, but funny like 9/11 jokes.
Imforcedtodothis
what did it say?
butwhatamisaying
Jammiepak
No judgement but I think you may have misread the tone of this post.
Rey4havana
Fuck you.
Gradwin
MrDeadsr
Isnt the dude also a huge twat that complained about only having a ps2 in his cell
BlacksMcNutt
Why is this guy still alive and costing you everyday. Why did you buy him a PS2 ???? Stop it.
kahdri
He's still whining. He even took his "unjust suffering" to the Court of Human Rights in Prague. Boo-fucking-hoo.
computerphile
His lawyer still claims he's showing signs of isolation damage. Let's fucking hope so
kahdri
Should've thought about that before he went an executed a bunch of children, shouldn't he? I hope he drowns in his whiny manbaby tears.
computerphile
This idiot hoped he would become a martyr, then pussied out and hoped he coudl become an imprisoned martyr. And now he's all alone in prison
kahdri
With his PS2. That he loathes.
JesusHCoxMD
First off, fuck those who down voted, and second, there's a special place in hell for people who kill kids. My love to the victims
Teases
They may just not like posts that mention a mass murderer's name. I for one would rather hear about the victims, not the murderer.
JesusHCoxMD
That is a downright logical answer
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
It's a difference in culture I suppose, this is a first to Norway and still is, so knowing every detail becomes vital to understanding it.
sundaymondayhippyday
Teases
But it's also a clearly understood thing. There's plenty of research to show that putting killers in the news tends to cause more acts>>
Teases
>>of violence. It may be new to have mass killings in Norway, but that does not mean it isn't already understood. Sadly US news still >>
Teases
>>publishes names and pictures of killers, even when told not to by the government for the same reason stated above.
mudflaps315
21 years???
bart147
in Year 20, they'll put him in general pop, and "Leak" what he did and when he's due to get out. Gen pop will take care of it.
Selerox
Full life sentences are relatively rare in Europe. In the UK they do exist as "full life tariffs", for offenders judged a permanent risk.
mooncheeser
I believe they have maximum sentencing limits. Also, Norway has one of the lowest recidivism rates in the world. (1)
mooncheeser
The US has one of the highest recidivism rates and the HIGHEST incarcerated population in the world.
sjleegketting
The Netherlands is the only European country where life incarceration is life incarceration. And we get criticized for it by the ECHR
ThySausagePrince
Isn't 20 years "life" in the US? Have an uncle sentenced to 4 life sentences, or 80 years, has to earn parole on each sentence separately.
ThySausagePrince
He's 56. Aka, he's never getting out.
blkbox
The system's maximum penalty is 21 years, but it doesn't forbid extending it.
MrsDreadful
21 years with the possibility of extension if he is still considered a threat to society.
MrsDreadful
It can be extended indefinitely...
Odmanra
European country penalty for breaking law is retarded!!! Too laxxed
MegaDeuce
What a fucking joke! Send him over to Texas, we'll show you Norwegians how real justice works.
humptyblargh
Keep in mind, that's 21 years with no PS4.
gigsra
Somebody will come after him though
rumandbass
You must not know any Norwegians.
EricEss
Doubtful.
StarboardSide
Norway things jail and death sentences are bad. Some jails over there are hotels
LurkerOfDarkness
Better approach than the US who use prisons as private slave labor camps.
cuntymcuntface
While better than the steel cages of the us, you're still confined. A cheap bed, desk and chair, a TV if you're nice, does not luxury make
BaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaBATMAN
Norway has a very high standard of living in general, and it's only natural that it reflects on how prisons look. What seems like a hotel to
IHonestlyCantCommitToAUsername
Is not so much a high standart of living as it is treating prisoners like people. Scandinavia believes in rehabilitation.
BaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaBATMAN
someone from a poorer country, could be below standard to a Norwegian.
SpreadyUnsettling
AND: It fucking works. Way lower rate of second offenders in all Scandinavian countries as opposed to the US, because of this approach.
Zangrieff
As a norwegian, I think he deserves death penalty. But there is no death penalty here
zagibu
What exactly makes him deserve the death penalty? Is there a certain number of people you have to kill, or when you kill children maybe?
Zangrieff
That sort of question is out my knowledge, but you certainly shouldnt be let off easily by killing 70+ people?
zagibu
Of course not. Still, the law must be based on rational decisions, not emotion. If you call for death sentence, you have to explain why.
Zangrieff
Breivik, who is not deemed insane, considered homicide as the best course of action to highlight his political views.
Zangrieff
He's in a comfortable cell in Norway complsining about the torture of having a ps2. Not the punishment I think he deserves
pyrotica
It gets revisited then extended in 5 year increments.
mudflaps315
Got ya
FirstOrderSympathizer
I hate it when people who talk about this don't explain how they can extend it after 21 years, and are definitely going to.
FirstOrderSympathizer
It makes Norway look crazy.
Shoumpue
Its crazier that they can just keep someone in jail indefinitely. His case it's fine, but others it's scary.
BaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaBATMAN
They can't do that for any prisoner, it's a difference between a regular prison sentence and the one that can be extended. The latter is
BaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaBATMAN
only used in the worst crimes, for the most dangerous inmates.
BaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaBATMAN
I bet every country has laws that makes them look crazy to outsiders because they don't understand the law or the intent behind it.
hully1977
Norway and most other countries rather aim for reintegration than locking up for life and/or death penalties
thorkun
500 year long sentences makes the US look crazy.
TheOtherBagdad
Exactly. What happens after 21yrs? He gets out and then what? The parents, friends and family of all those people must ask the same question
MrsDreadful
1. Norway believes in rehabilitating criminals, and it has a very high success rate.
alexjonesisagayfrog
No they just have a great criminal justice system focused on rehabilitation.But don’t worry he’ll never get out they can extend it if deemed
alexjonesisagayfrog
A threat which he’ll likely be
LurkerOfDarkness
He'll be evaluated before any release happens, if they don't think it's safe to let him out he'll be kept in prison.
MrsDreadful
3. The Norwegian maximum sentence is 21 years with the possibility of extension as long as he is a threat to society. He will never get out.
MrsDreadful
2. The Norwegian prison system is mainly designed to protect the public, rather than punish the inmates.
Artsisdead
1/2Europe has different life sentences and believes more in reintegration, that said, they will never release him because they have the
Krawlin
Go on....
[deleted]
[deleted]
ComoSeIguana
Brochiavelli
2/2 secret human zoo, which he will be sold into shortly after the end of his term.
tugboatcaptain
You got me. You ass!
Brochiavelli
Iamthebeekeepernow
2/2 (let me help out) ..Option to keep people longer in Prison if they are a threat to Society. Psychologists test them
CryptoLee
InRetrospectIShouldveLearnedToSwimBeforeBecomingaSailor
This isn't a "Europe" thing. Each country has its own laws and sentencing length.
Iamthebeekeepernow
Germany is similar. „Lifelong“ means 15 years. Longer can be possible but only if you are a threat to society
InRetrospectIShouldveLearnedToSwimBeforeBecomingaSailor
So someone that would end up with a life term anyway...
RockingStolpe
Probably more of a Scandinavian thing.
DukePhelan
Not long enough for some family members to come after him. I hope they take their time.
LurkerOfDarkness
Your eye for an eye approach belongs back in the dark ages, not in a modern society like Norway.
edward8767
I think you should try to contact the families of the victims with that message. See how that works out
primarian
Never let yourself succumb to barbarism.
idonthaveanyideawhatthehelliamtalkingabout
Those families are part of the country of Norway, the country that choose to have it like this.
LurkerOfDarkness
They're behind it.
DeanSledgehammer
What about death sentence for mass murderers? Why pay for irredeemable persons prison care?
TomtheGrizzly
The cost of death penalty is ridiculously high. I'd rather pay for life sentence with chances of rehabilitation than for death penalty.
Eramik
Death sentence also belongs in the dark ages
DeanSledgehammer
Would you see Breivik ever released from prison? No. Is there a chance he's innocent? No. Then what's the point?
LurkerOfDarkness
Exactly.
tzap
If you want to prove the likes of Breivik wrong, don't hope that.
ColBiff
And he's in a plush prison cell compared to the US. F that guy
namelessone
Well, just because US prisons are hellish, doesn't mean he shouldn't be in the prison cell he's in. It means US conditions should improve.
UrKungFuNoGood
lol
VanDammesForeheadCyst
American felons are released from prison with appalling rates of PTSD.
SpreadyUnsettling
No reason to dismantle a great prison system just because one guy deserves worse.
ThefluteCaptainPicardplayedfirstinhisimaginationtheninreallife
it's not the overcrowded hell-hole that US prisons are, but it's hardly plush. I was curious so i looked it up (picture in next reply)
ThefluteCaptainPicardplayedfirstinhisimaginationtheninreallife
more than he deserves, but not exactly a Hilton, https://splinternews.com/this-is-what-an-inhuman-prison-cell-looks-like-in-norwa-1793856364
flyingmonsters
That place looks like a US college dorm haha. What a joke.
GlebReawer
That's an interesting take on the US education system, considering how much you have to pay for it in the first place.
OverlyOpinionated
Way nicer than my dorm room
SoftBonez
that plush prison cell system works to reintegrate prisoners, yours doesnt. thats why ours is better.
flyingmonsters
I mean let's be honest he isn't gonna be reintegrated. He's in that cell for the rest of his life. To think otherwise is nuts
LoudBirb
For this one case sure, but look up Norway's recidivism rates vs the US's before you judge their system as a whole. It works.
ifartgalaxies
It slaughtered 78 people. Don't even say the word reintegration around that. Slaughter that thing like the animal it is and move on.
spareseatonmyface
Classic.
IHaveABridgeToSell
That’s not the way a civilized society responds to this kind of acts. That’s barbaric and we must be better.
ifartgalaxies
i disagree
Artsisdead
2/2 Right to detain him indefinitely if evaluated to be a danger to society by psychiatrists. So it’s no guarantee he’s free after 21 years
DaftKid
Wasn't it 21 years per murder?
spareseatonmyface
Yes but in Europe you serve those sentences concurrently rather than consecutively.
InRetrospectIShouldveLearnedToSwimBeforeBecomingaSailor
You realise that each country has its own sentencing laws, right...?
spareseatonmyface
I do, but for the most part, this holds true.
TanDumpLord
He will most likely spend his entire life in jail, as they can't guarantee that he will be safe upon release.
aleksel1337
He will be killed if he is released. That humanity can guarantee. But he won't be.
XplodingLarsen
there was an incident in jail where another inmate almost got to him. He has to be in total isolation from other I mates for his own safety
SMODomite
Yeah thats weird, once you complete a sentence in the US you are released. Although the US criminal justice system is completely fucked
Mithi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dangerous_offender#United_States
Upinthecold
And if he is ever release he has to first show remorse and admit his manifesto is worthless. For him, that is worse then life sentence
dragonfruitsonfire
Oh thank god
michonnedisapproves
Hopefully he kills himself in jail
nickiskovby1
No.. he is miserable in jail and he threatens to starve himself because of his conditions. Let him suffer for the rest of his life.
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MonkeyHittingPianoDramatically
They dont let him interact with other people except the guards. He wants to write stuff online as well
ImpsCorner
So it's a guarantee 21 years then? And then after they can decided to just extend it until they find him no longer a threat to the public?
kahdri
Pretty much, yes. 21 years for certain, and then they will decide whether to continue to keep him after that. Considering he is unrepentant>
kahdri
it is a given they will keep him behind bars for much, much longer than 21 years. It's just the maximum we can sentence someone to here.
TheDuke0fHazzard
It's sorta like going up for parole in the US, where a board decides if you're a threat or not. He obviously is, so they won't release him.
Dragon0562
more like til the public is no longer a threat to him.
OverpricedCrayon
I believe it can be extended 5 years at a time after the initial 21 years. Theyll extend it 5 years every 5 years til he dies.
TanDumpLord
They will probably never release him. He was a never before seen challenge for our legal system and still continues to be.
ruferto
That said, who knows, 21 years is enough time for someone to change.
TheRocketFiend
We’re talking about willfully murdering children. If you believe he’ll change, I’ve got some lovely property on the moon to sell you.
Dragon0562
so far he's don'e nothing but bitch, and continue his rantings. some can change and we can hope for it. but him...I doubt it
SMODomite
Seriously. For fucks sake it is crazy to think he could be a free person again. Dude should never see the light of day again
TimePressure
evaluate his continuous danger, justice is served. Life sentences are just as stupid as are death sentences. (2/2)
primarian
He will never be a free man again. They can continue to detain him.
teakasaurus
Don’t worry, he probably won’t.
TimePressure
It is necessary to rule this way- only then there is the chance of reintegration, for everyone. Only if a board of specialists have to (1/2)
BaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaBATMAN
He wont. His type of sentence is one that can be extended indefinitely. Only the worst crime gets this type, which are not regular sentences
BaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaNaBATMAN
The only reason he got as little as 21 is because that's the maximum allowed. But it doesn't really matter for this type of sentence/crime.
bitemark
What if, instead of using prison to punish (which tends to make reoffenders), it was used to rehabilitate? That's how it works there.
SpreadyUnsettling
To those who obviously don't get this: It's about upholding a system that works, and not bending it just because Breivik is a monster.
SMODomite
I am all about rehabilitation, something like two mass terror attacks though? Some people are too far gone
Boondangle40
You dont rehabilitate someone who murdered 77 people.... You execute them
whooptydoo
No, you cannot fight hate with hate, it just doesnt work. To make a murderer see the wrong in their ways you must show them forgiveness, 1/2
whooptydoo
That will make them truly hurt.
Swomuchfun
He can't reoffend if he never leaves the jail
LurkerOfDarkness
It's expensive to keep people in prison, they cost money and contribute virtually nothing to society.
trubblebot
He probably won't ever leave jail, they can extend his sentence indefinitely.
GuyPrice
Check crime and recidivism in US vs there before you start questioning their ways.
whooptydoo
For a second i thought you meant the us did well and i was gonna habe to go on a tirade, but you didnt so +1
UrKungFuNoGood
wait. do you think that the 21 year prison "limit that isn't really a limit" will solve recidivism in the US? lmfao
VanDammesForeheadCyst
Or we can continue with the "limits that aren't really limits" we have in the US. *shrug*
zFUBARz
Seems pretty clear he was implying that the prison system in Norway is more effective at rehabilitation.
iamcoolmike
No of course not. It's a result of a system of rehabilitation rather than a cause of rehabilitation
babybirdhome
It's not about the length, it's about what they do with that length. Norway is not a vindictive, angry, hateful country like the U.S. is.
UrKungFuNoGood
Ah I figured there was a narrative in there somewhere.
jss821
No but their rehabilitation and reintegration approach works better than our system.
CrazyCatLad
Just joining the convo now but I don't think some people deserve rehab/reintegration.
TokyosNotFarEnough
Considering Norway had a total pop of @5M & just TX has @23M in 2017. Norway's prison pop was 74/100K & US 655/100K. Also our prisons are (1
TokyosNotFarEnough
for profit. It doesn't make the stakeholders $ to rehab prisoners. Esp when stakeholders are politicians. So more prisoners & $ = no rehab.
theportablecat
"21 years?! This rich, peaceful country is doing something different from us and therefore is DOOMED and STUPID" -Americans on the internet
TrishTheDish22
Really? You want to include all Americans in your comment? What’s that say about you? SMH
VanDammesForeheadCyst
He/she is referencing the Americans saying those things.
bob493
Prison isnt only for rehabilitation. Its also supposed to be a punishment. 21 years of your life in return for killing 74 people is Bullshit
MegaDeuce
Exactly. So if I kill a man I get 3 and half months?
bob493
I do understand that they can extend the sentences now, but my gut reaction on seeing "21 years" was not a good one.
VanDammesForeheadCyst
Then let's stop going with our guts and use our brains. :)
bob493
My "brain" sees "21 years (the max under law)" and directly infers that his sentence is 21 years. Im not sure how else to take that.