Theshnazzyone
6021
375
41
Point: Democratic electorate needs to be more unified and ignore anything that says the solution is not to vote, See 2016 and 2024. When you use excuses not to vote you fuck the whole country over. Ignore the people making excuses, their motivations are very clear.
Scattercat
No, fuck off. The Democrats aren't the same, but they *are* a very conservative party that primarily supports corporate capitalism with the lightest soupçon of regulation. Leftists very sensibly would like to vote for an *actually left-leaning* party and have trouble getting excited for "Let's bomb Iran but do a little dance about it first instead of having the fascist leader announce it on his own."
tentaclefriendly
Most of the people who walked away from the Democrats in 16 and 24 were not far leftists.
There's not enough of them.
It was mostly swing state low engagement low information blue collar voters who only saw that the previous administration's recovery had left them behind, told them they were wrong when they complained, and the Democratic candidate was offering nothing but more of the same.
StellarJay77
How the fuck can anyone think that 'not voting' sends any meaningful message to anyone that matters? It just makes them even more irrelevant and says "don't pay any attention to me because I'm litterally not doing the one thing that any politician cares about from their constituents".
300Hectares1TankofKerosene
I agree, but the current Democrats are possibly the least inspiring, least proactive, and MOST milquetoast party of all time. As a whole they are failing to take the initiative and the door is wide open. I guess they just want to default themselves into popularity.
Theshnazzyone
This was a fun experiment, it's interesting to see the line of discussion change based on a minor word change but still boil down to justifying not voting and to reinforce divisions in the democratic electorate. Like we got spam bots here or something.
CloudyTime
Does it strike you as at all hypocritical that you say the left needs to be more unified while blaming leftists for Trump and trying to sow as much division as possible?
Pelican3
Yeah and remind them not to vote for Jill Stein or Ralph Nader
Taokan22
This. If you're not happy with the democrat running, get involved. Look into primaries. Primaries get such underwhelming attention, but they're really where the sausage gets made in terms of what's going to be the overall platform ... the ideas that win out in primaries inform what the broader, more holistic agenda should be. But, failing to vote, is being partially responsible for the insanity that's taking place now as a result. The deportations, the tariffs, the war in Iran...
Theshnazzyone
Been spamming this link, Your primaries are likely VERY soon. https://www.ncsl.org/elections-and-campaigns/2026-state-primary-election-dates
PresldentClef
Plenty of professional imgur gaslighters on that matter like clockwork too.
Theshnazzyone
They working real hard to keep that one comment at the top.
LeumisRichardson
This is exactly when it is most important to vote in and get involved in your primaries.
LazerSpacePirate
Think for yourself and question authority.
Svartsinn
Republicans destroy the economy by handing more money to the rich and dems inherit the rotting mess. Dems can't do enough to fix it, and then voters get frustrated and turn back to republicans who promise to make everything better. And then republicans give money to the rich again and the cycle continues.
Helixninja333
And if that doesn't work, voter manipulation in many forms, gerrymandering, weakening voting by mail, and actually rigging the election itself.
Theshnazzyone
If only someone warned them in 2024, oh wait everyone was warning them but they instead took the bait and now literally everything they were warned would happen would happen. It wouldn't seem so bad if any one of the folks I saw were capable of any form of humility in realizing they were told the truth by the side they rejected.
MrSatisify
scrumbles666
Withholding your vote does make parties change or better options appear. Never has, never will.
Theshnazzyone
It misses the point (assuming you meant doesn't) why are politicians going to work for a fickle crowd? Republicans are the way they are and got so many things they wanted by making sure they always vote that way. Dems weakness is the people who need to vote of them to make things better are fickle as fuck and sadly as easily emotionally manipulated as a fox news viewer at times.
zechor
While you're at it push your representatives, and whoever pulls their strings, to pass ranked choice voting so that no votes get wasted and we can start electing people who are beholden to the people instead of the party.
Theshnazzyone
Hell yeah!
BillyBabel
Democrats counter this notion by mostly doing fuckall when elected.
I absolutely understand and agree with ppl who vote for democrats as harm reduction but let’s not pretend it’s the republicans who have convinced voters to be apathetic to democrats when democrats have worked to actively suppress popular candidates and fail to improve their voters material conditions bc for some reason democrat politicians I guess see it as “crass” just outright doing things for their voters
Theshnazzyone
They had slim control of the house and senate after 2020 and republicans sabotaged most the major legislation attempted and they were primarily focused on recovery after the pandemic. in 2022 everyone forgot midterms mattered and they lost the house. Criticizers seem to think there's a magic wand and no opposition. 9/10 you can point to republicans for why the stuff you want didn't get to be signed. Don't think enough people get that. But wow for getting 9 upvotes within an hour of your comment.
BillyBabel
Are you forgetting Obama who brought a watered down health bill that was drafted by the heritage foundation? Or the dnc who in court after having been legally proven to have rigged the primary against Bernie said that they have no obligation to be fair as they’re a private entity. Or Biden who allowed Covid protections that had totally ended child poverty to expire purely bc his corporate overlords whined that no one wanted to work? Maybe blue maga is the problem.
alex5775
"Republicans sabotaged most the major legislation attempted" ah right, like the Covid relief bill that Biden handed to them to sabotage in the name of bipartisanship. Also isn't odd that Republicans can so effectively sabotage dems when dems have a small majority, but Democrats get steamrolled by a small Republican majority?
BillyBabel
Ppl really be on here going “no the Washington generals would beat those globe trotters if they just played fair”
BillyBabel
Also that magic wand would have been repealing the filibuster with a simple majority, using reconciliation to continue Covid payments and not allowing the parliamentarian an unelected individual that they can fire at any time to block the raising of the minimum wage.
badbuddhist
I think this is one of the most damaging narrative of the left. Like the cartoon of that boat sinking while democrats are furiously trying to bail it out, there's nothing within our legal system that democrats can do. Then people say they do fuckall. If you think we need to resort to violence, go ahead, but fuckall that *can* be done
BillyBabel
The senate could at any time simply change the filibuster with the nuclear option. It requires only 51 votes. Democrats claim they dont do this bc then if republicans get power they can pass whatever they want, which 1. is an amazing way of telling your electorate that you plan on losing, and 2. maybe not a concern if they actually did what their voters wanted.
The most dangerous idea for democracy is believing that capitalists and democracy can co exist and democrats are all capitalists
netutoring
I see OP wants to create cheerleaders for the Democrats instead of critical thinkers. Being capable of voting for the person who gets you closer to your goals and still being critical of that person and pushing them towards better policy is what moves things forward. Being silent when the people you vote for do dumb shit is not a way to govern.
Theshnazzyone
Who turned on the bots an hour ago? Do you think you don't have control over the process of which democrats get elected to represent you?
https://www.ncsl.org/elections-and-campaigns/2026-state-primary-election-dates
YOUR PRIMARIES ARE COMING UP.
netutoring
.....what? That sentence made no sense.
Theshnazzyone
You must not know how Primaries work. Primaries are the process that congressmen and senators get selected. Sometimes primaries can have gaps as close as a few hundred votes, so your vote DEFINITELY COUNTS! It's a great way to help guide your chosen electoral party to support issues you support and an important part of american democracy.
LostCaterpillar
The secret to understanding people like OP is that for them democrats supporting genocide or attacking trans folks or any of the other myriad sins committed by "centrist" democrats is that for them those aren't unfortunate compromises, those are policies they actively support
That's why the "Vote Blue No Matter Who" crowd was real loud about how Mamdani supporters better fall in line when he loses the primary only to become real critical of him and tacitly or openly support Cuomo in the general
Daliena06
Goddamn right. "Blue no matter who" seems to always, ALWAYS translate into "You need to vote for the corporate whore, because we sure as hell won't vote for the good guy instead, and if you don't, then it's YOUR fault that blue lost the election!"
Theshnazzyone
Wow, you popped in seconds after that guy? What a coincidence, you two should kiss.
Daliena06
Coincidences do happen. Whether you believe it or not is not particularly my business I suppose.
Theshnazzyone
This is your reminder. Make sure you vote in your primaries if you want to help shift the actions of the democrats. Because that's how politics work and you should learn that. But doom yourself to the term "tran" being outlawed and no hope of ever ending Iran support by listening to this guy if you want.
https://www.ncsl.org/elections-and-campaigns/2026-state-primary-election-dates
LostCaterpillar
Been voting in primaries my whole life, thx. Hasn't helped worth a damn because it's real hard to fight the massive pile of money poured into your favored candidates campaign.
But let's examine your stance a little here. Remind me, which president was it that finally pulled us out of Afghanistan? And sure, that wasn't the right way to do it nor necessarily the right call at all but he sure as fuck didn't have a blue hat.
What a stupid argument to make.
Scattercat
This is the first non-bullshit thing you've said in this entire comment section that you're babysitting like a goose with its first eggs.
Theshnazzyone
Just a fascination in seeing the orchestrated attack on it.
canigifinpaint
It's so true, and such a mind fuck. Republicans call all Democrats "far-left radicals" while the largest companies in the world run platforms that appeal to young, left-leaning people and relentlessly attack any Democrat with a shred of popularity. The Supreme Court overturned a law Gavin Newsom signed to protect trans kids in CA, and all anyone can seem to talk about is how Newsom is "anti-trans". I would say don't sip on the koolaid, but they're just chugging it...
rekcomeht
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2025-10-17/newsom-vetoes-key-health-measure-transgendeitics">https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2025-10-17/nr-pol">itics">https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2025-10-17/ne">e">r-pol">itics">https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2025-10-17/newsom-vetoes-key-health-measure-transgender-politics
https://www.kqed.org/news/12060369/tracking-newsoms-record-on-pro-lgbtq-laws-signed-and-vetoed-this-session
https://calmatters.org/politics/2025/03/newsom-transgender-athletes/
https://www.politico.com/news/2025/02/26/gavin-newsom-podcast-maga-00206153
canigifinpaint
The only bills that Newsom vetoed in regards to trans people are the ones that would have increased healthcare costs. One required expedited licenses, another required 12 months of HRT on supply for every patient, and the third required expedited licenses for out of state healthcare providers. Trans people still have access to gender affirming care in California, and thanks to Newsom its more affordable than it would have been if those bills were signed into law.
Theshnazzyone
don't bother with that guy.
ThingsThatDontJustifyGenocide
@OP, you're under the impression that 2016 and 2024 were lost by republicans going "hey fellow kids, you see that fascism we enable? The dems are just as bad"
That's not what happened. In 2016, that many people just liked a fucking blowhard piece of shit, and also were sexist fuckbags, plus all the russian collusion with the campaign and that traitorous fuckbag who "leaked details of investigation". It wasn't the leftists that failed, then.
And 2024... continued.
ThingsThatDontJustifyGenocide
And 2024, @OP, was after years of republicans purging voter rolls and changing voting locations and the rules of voting to make it dramatically harder for CERTAIN PEOPLE to be able to equitably have the ability to vote, such that it was severe voter disenfranchisement. And you may think "well the leftists and kamala and she wanted to support the genocide", but no, the republican cheating has a bigger impact, and the leftists voted for her, only non-leftist idiots who don't pay attention didn't
Theshnazzyone
I don't know, the people who called themselves leftist I know, who were also on tik tok. Seemed to think the only thing that mattered was Gaza in the election and those tik toks always were directed at democrats exclusively as if republicans just didn't exist. I had to beg some to vote anyway so that misinfo was hardcore.
ThingsThatDontJustifyGenocide
"I used tiktok as my source for leftists"
Tell me you have a negative relationship with critical thinking without telling me in those exact words, I guess.
My hostility here is because you accused me of helping trump because you're a dickless fucking loser fuckbag who hates the left.
ChiLLeCheeze
It's also wild to me that people call Bernie Bros "Leftists" when they voted Trump. What kind of Leftist goes straight fascism? Leftists masquerading as fascists to me.
Theshnazzyone
In the Mueller report, definitely showed Russian propaganda efforts focused heavily to get former Bernie supporters to not take part in the election.
ChiLLeCheeze
Right, but Bernie isn't a Leftist at all and neither are the majority of his supporters. If you were leftist, you would understand at least why you're leftist. *Hint* For me it's the genocide, imperialism, etc. If you're a leftist and still vote fascism while understanding this, then you're just a fascist pretending to be a leftist. I had someone say, "No True Scotsmen". Except... Leftists would be against fascism. It boggles the mind the mental gymnastics Americans go through.
Scattercat
Bernie would qualify as a leftist, I think. Center-left at the furthest in a sane political environment, but he's generally got okay ideas, for the most part, when he puts stuff forward and gets slapped down by the corporations.
urusername2
Ya, they got to my son. I begged him to vote Kamala. His response was "they're both the same". The Repuglicans made Commie a 'bad word' in the 50s. They keep using the term. Guys like Bernie are NOT Communist. They are Socialist. Communism isn't successful because you are supposed to give all the work you can, and take only what they need. Lazy/greedy people ruin that. But Socialist Democrats have a workable system. Look at the Nordic countries. >
Theshnazzyone
hell yeah Brother. I 100% back you up. That's what I saw too and I won't be gaslit.
zufallszahlen
They're not even socialist or democratic socialists, they're social democrats.
urusername2
They all have Universal Health Care; something the GOP has blocked as a Commie Idea.
BillyBabel
It’s ironic you talk about commie being a bad word while regurgitating what is an absolutely incorrect understanding of communism. Communism is about the workers controlling the means of production, instead of a factory having an owner and stockholders, the people who work in the factory collectively own the factory and vote on how it should run, there’s no expectation of magical self sacrifice
urusername2
You didn't read my post
BillyBabel
I did. You incorrectly described communism as something that doesn’t work bc ppl are greedy
urusername2
You forgot lazy. Are you saying that the entire population doesn't contain enough lazy/greedy people that the system wouldn't crash. It needs more structure than the people's good will.
BillyBabel
Lazy and greedy don’t matter any more than they do in any business that exists now. Even less so bc if your boss is greedy then you can’t do anything about it. If you think that lazy and greedy ppl “ruin” communism you don’t understand communism.
CloudyTime
This would be a good point if it was true, but it isn’t really. Far more traditionally democratic voters (coal miners, older Hispanic men, union types) went to Trump in 2024 than leftists sat out. It’s true that many eligible voters don’t vote, but the vast majority of them are not super politically engaged leftists. Most of them are the apathetic, checked out, “I don’t follow politics” types.
Theshnazzyone
Are you referring to 1950 pre internet democratic party? Who is upvoting you?
CloudyTime
People who go outside sometimes. You should give it a shot, I promise it can be nice!
CloudyTime
This kind of thinking comes from spending a bunch of time online, where it seems like everyone is either a full on leftist, an open Neo Nazi, or so centrist they would defend “reasonable” genocide. But the Imgur comment section does not represent the electorate. Like, at all.
canigifinpaint
It's very much true, it happens even here on Imgur. Post after post attacking Democrats with purity tests, while ignoring everything Republicans do to destroy our society.
CloudyTime
The Imgur comments section is not representative of the electorate. Every single person on this site that comments religiously under every political post could move to Malta and it would have zero effect on the next election. Internet bubble != reality.
canigifinpaint
You know that even the DNC autopsy said that Leftists refused to vote for Kamala right? You seem to be looking for the straw the broke the camel's back, but in reality it's every straw together that broke it. We can look at the data if you want, but it's not like you provided any in your original post so I'm not sure why you're bringing it up after the fact to attack my practical example.
CloudyTime
Your “practical example” is the Imgur comment section. Again, that is not a representative slice of the electorate. If you can’t see that, then there is no way to have a reasonable conversation with you. Seriously, just look up how Hispanic males voted in 2024 vs 2020. Putting your personal, anecdotal experience above the voting data is just silly.
canigifinpaint
Already turning to insults? Sounds like you're the one who isn't willing to approach this in good faith... but sure, let's look at actual data. 15% of Biden voters dropped off in 2024, meaning they didn't vote at all. Only 5% switched from Biden to Trump. So you're wrong, more people refused to vote for Harris than switched to Trump. I can even provide a source for the data, which you conveniently forgot to do in your little vibes post up there. Blaming hispanic males for it is super weird btw.
GoodChange
The dnc produced a report about Kamala’s loss but then decided not to release it. Did they change their mind and release it or are you referring to something else?
canigifinpaint
It wasn't made by the DNC, it was an autopsy of the DNC made by a journalist https://democraticautopsy.org/how-democrats-lost-the-white-house/
GoodChange
Complaining about dems and centrists online and hoping they will get better is not the same as not voting
req4adream99
But it does encourage not voting - same as bad reviews on a product encourage people not to buy it.
It’s a hard connection to make I get it. /s
meme2zombie
No, but there are both types on here.
Theshnazzyone
Hey you were the one semanticing up my last post with copy paste stuff!
Theshnazzyone
Fun question, what do you think is the proper way to go forward? Just give me a run down of how we are supposed to defeat the republicans and try to reclaim our country from the impending foot of fascism. No excuses. Give your best solution. I will call you out on anything less than what you think is the best way forward.
GoodChange
Get money out of politics.
Theshnazzyone
That is pretty bare bones. What's a realistic way to accomplish that? Many democrats want that too. No republicans though.
canigifinpaint
How do you feel about the largest left-leaning voices online saying they won't vote Democrat if Gavin Newsom is the nominee in 2028?
GoodChange
Why would they say anything else at this point? Hopefully a better candidate can be found and if he is the candidate they can decide if they have changed their minds or not.
canigifinpaint
There you go right there. You guys will choose a fascist over a centrist democrat as if the two could ever be compared outside of an edgy youtube comment. I just don't understand why, my current theory is that you're are all super privileged rich kids, and insulted from rising costs, housing crises, homelessness, deportation, and anti-trans/anti-women legislation.
Theshnazzyone
think you might be a gaslighter, buddy. Now get your friends to downvote me like you have done in my last post and here.
taez555
Despite the narrative, I can't say I've seen anyone on the left tell young leftists not to vote. It's mostly just trolls pushing the narrative and trying to place blame on the voter (or non-voter in this case), rather than on the party that lacks convictions.
Theshnazzyone
I guess you're right, none of the people who i see openly criticizing the democrats seem to actually be left in any way shape and form and are likely not even actually americans.
DevilsAdvocat
then, to use your own words.. Maybe you aren't paying attention.. I'm constantly debating people on this site who are falling for the fallacy of nirvana and not understanding that though we need to absolutely hold the dems accountable, which they are holding them to the fire for not being left enough, that conflating them as being as bad as the right is just giving the right a win.. telling people they're not seeing something when you're obviously not paying attention is, well one way to do it
Daliena06
Hello, criticizer of Democrats here. Left, very much, American, no.
Nonetheless, I will goddamn well keep telling people that they should demand more from people who are supposed to represent then than the absolute bare minimum of "is not a fascist".
If you're gonna go the path that some here do and insist that that makes me MAGA because I think the American people should be represented by better than Fetterman, Sinema, Newsom etc. and that ANY criticism of ANY dem is fascism, then alas.
meme2zombie
I can't be 100% certain they're not trolls but there's lots of people claiming to be from the left telling people to not vote for democrats. In the US voting 3rd party is the same as not voting.
FrankGrenadine
I usually see it phrased in more passive ways about turnout or discouraged voters (with implication that if democrats tack too much to center than left will stay home)
meme2zombie
Yeah that's common too.
pelon77Cleveland
Yeah! The Republican and Democratic parties power has created a duopoly thus invalidating anyone who wants to vote different than the shit these parties shove down our throats and therefore it’s the voters fault for not wanting more options and not the conflicted power within the parties.
meme2zombie
It's not their fault for wanting it, it's their fault for acting in ways that doesn't help them get it while pretending their actions that empower the fascists are the moral high ground.
scrumbles666
Not voting doesn't get you more options. Never has, never will. All it does is insure the greater evil wins and more people suffer and die for the sake of your self-righteous entitlement to a better world you won't actually work towards.
netutoring
Depends on the level. The further up the chain you go, the stronger the hold of the two party system. At the local level, voting for a third party is still feasible. That's just the nature of our system.
meme2zombie
Oh definitely, I was thinking federal elections. Yeah any 3rd party that wants to show they're real they'll start local.
netutoring
I wrote a few papers on the whole stupid system we have:P And about different electoral systems... obviously, this is anecdotal. Research what I say. I know I have degrees...you don't;)
Theshnazzyone
Remember Gaza in 2024, remember Bernie in 2016? That's where i saw people saying exactly that. I also saw the part where the bernie narrative in 2016 was shown to be intensified by russian propagandists in the Mueller report. Maybe you aren't paying attention.
taez555
I've seen a lot of people conflate those who criticize the democrats and their polices as being ones who tell people not vote.
Theshnazzyone
Okay, I expect you to criticize republicans at least 30 times as much as you criticize democrats. Also I expect the criticisms you have for democrats to have specific examples that range within the last 1-2 years. None of that bringing up 5 year old situations, none of that pretending nothing has changed about the party in 30 years, there needs to be a balance of criticizing the democrats which also lauds the good changes they've made.
alex5775
No bringing up anything outside of literally their most recent presidency? Okay how about 1 year ago just after the 2nd Trump term started, Dick Durbin was asked who was leading the charge against Trump. He just said "this is all very new". That is unacceptable, they'd had at least the months after the election to prepare and should have been preparing for the possibility of loss long before then. Why didn't they? Stupidity is the most favorable answer and not one I buy.
ThingsThatDontJustifyGenocide
"I expect you to criticize the nazis 30 times as much as you ask the people who you vote for to do better" fucking why, they're fucking nazis, calling them nazis is the end of it, they won't get my fucking vote, I need the people who DO GET MY VOTE to NOT FUCKING WORK WITH NAZIS
YOU are the one pulling the shit you whine about, @OP, fuck's sake.
Theshnazzyone
Interesting username, did you check that before you responded or are you proud of getting Trump elected?
taez555
If I'm the coach and it's halftime during the game, I find it's more helpful to tell my own team what they can do to win the 2nd half, rather than spend all my time talking about what the other team is doing right to win.
Theshnazzyone
That analogy doesn't work in this context. It's just gobblety gook.
Scahrossar
This seems like such a weird american thing. It almost seems like a crime to criticize "your" people. You should criticize those you voted for the hardest. They work for you after all and should do their fucking job.
Daliena06
Just yesterday got into a bit of a row with someone here when I said that people shouldn't just become a blind MAGA-esque cult and never, ever question anyone with a (D) by their name, and got told that I'm a MAGA bootlicker who wants fascists to always win.
Because apparently, "demand better than the absolute bare minimum from your representatives" is actually subliminal fascist propaganda so I should shut the fuck up about Fetterman being a disappointment, for example.
netutoring
Just a different color boot those people want us to lick.
Theshnazzyone
A great example is people claiming after 2016 that Bernie was being shut out of the party, when Bernie has actually been given several democratic leadership positions over the last 6 years that he would have never seen before his 2016 run.
scrumbles666
The Dems made a colossal misstep in not giving Bernie at the very least a significant cabinet position, and I do think that reflects how resistant the upper echelons of the party were, and still are, to the change Bernie represented. But fuck the amount of childish 'I didn't get exactly what I wanted so everyone must be plotting against me' energy in that conspiracy shit about his loss...
Theshnazzyone
Here's the list of all the committees Dems put him in after 2020.
https://www.sanders.senate.gov/about-bernie/committee-assignments/
Bernie is a legislator