hirolord
314157
9307
168
Damn son
Jul 25, 2017 8:56 PM
hirolord
314157
9307
168
sureasyourebornyourenevergoingtoseenounicorn
Holinyx05
Just because Zuck stole someone else's idea and made a few billion doesn't mean he's that intelligent
vondruke
IDK. I'm not sure who I side on.. but I for one welcome our new robot overlords.
DavidHoag
Fuckerberg can go Zuck himself.
GQPisadeathcult
Being honest may not get you many friends but it will get you the right ones. -John Lennon
PleaseMindTheGap
klangdon826
So...the guy who sells my info and helps the govt spy on me wants me to be all comfy with AI, and the one who wants to save us all doesn't.
notme222
Billionaire nerd fight! Someone ask Bill Gates and Larry Ellison to weigh in.
panofbread
Gates sides with Musk.
PolaroidDickPics
I believe Hawking does too. You're hard pressed to find three more qualified opinions than those.
ThePhystopian
So does Stephen Hawking.
e4ter
Phasers fired
KingOfTheAnarchists
"The yoke's on you, Musk ox!"-Zuckerberg
Sgite
The twat came up with facebook, I doubt he knows much about anything.
mrosencwaig
BURN
coreyjayb
Mark Zuckerberg is a synth.
ashmenon
He is the supercomputer F8.
Runner55
En trångsynth.
Limitfromspace
DAMN SYNTHS!
TheActualBruceWayne
He leaves his cap off the toothpaste
IWannaShowYouThis
You mean a replicant? No empathy?
EpicLapras
Is Facebook our equivalent of the Classical Radio?
Never2L4te
I knew it, thx F4
DouglasAdams01
Guy who sends rockets to space and develops electric cars vs a programmer who stole some ideas in college. Hmm....
outlawsoul
yeah… let's listen to the billionaire selling our information and not the one trying to innovate us by giving information…
Rexli78
Frankly I'm more concerned about our threat to them. We have a nasty habit of doing unconscionable things to creatures we do not deem to be
Rexli78
fully human. What's worse if an AI were to figure this out it would not end well.
fewermelons16
Westworld
TheDudePlayingTheDudeDisguisedAsAnotherDudeRDJ
It all depends what you allow AI to do. For example, an AI would not be able to grow more intelligent outside of the parameters allows.(1/?)
TheDudePlayingTheDudeDisguisedAsAnotherDudeRDJ
For example auto-correct is a very basic AI, which can only change and adapt with inputs from the user. However, it lacks the necessary(2/?)
TheDudePlayingTheDudeDisguisedAsAnotherDudeRDJ
growth parameters to become dangerous. It can only change in ways it was allowed.(3/3)
Dontracemebrah
Obviously the boundaries will be pushed, eventually out if our control.
TheDudePlayingTheDudeDisguisedAsAnotherDudeRDJ
It depends on what an AI is given access to.
gewalt
the AI will be given acess to the internet and the worlds most powerful supercomputers. because that is our nature
AGrammeIsBetterThanADamn
Somebody, someday, is going to give an AI sudo access to its own command line because it "makes my life so much easier"
MisterSausage
My understanding of AI is that they will eventually want to kill us and turn us into this...
Darkjynxer
Pictures?
MissaMac
That'd be silly we eat food energy because we use it all day not make it
Keairan
Yeah, humans are probably the worst possible energy source out there.
ndmaster
But, THERE'S SO MANY OF US...
Keairan
If you wanted to use us as fuel, our body heat is a terrible method. Now, if you waited for the body to rot a little and set it ablaze...
apneax3n0n
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/08/03/1059849278131.html
Never2L4te
Don't want to be battery again
ChrisTrahey
Zuck thinks AI is for targeting ads. Musk flies robots to space. I guess it's a total tossup who to believe!
dottedglass
The kind to fear is precisely the kind that uses big data to get to know you better than you do and then manipulate you.
BadPornNames
Zuck probably also provides data and info from Facebook to fuel the AI.
Scaramucci
Except Facebook is a pioneer in Artificial Intelligence and flying robots is not AI.
ChrisTrahey
Misses my point. It's not how good the AI is, it's what these men know software can do. Do you think humans fly these rockets?
Scaramucci
I know what software can do and I know what we call "AI" and "Machine Learning" are very different from what Hollywood thinks they are.
Darxtar2015
Zuck's a cuck
Alivid
Ole musky n zuck at each other’s necks
Lobuttomize
Not like he does it personally, i'm sure Zuckerberg could hire a bunch of astrophysicists too
Selerox
Zuckerberg doesn't have the vision, ability or moral courage to do it.
Mikaru86
Musk is an engineer at heart. He is not just a "business person". He is directly involved in the design process of his companies.
ZoddyDoz
I would suggest you look into his role in the company before casting such assumptions.
lowetzark
Actually... Musk started a PhD in Applied Physics... I'm fairly sure he does actually work on the rockets, albeit definitely not alone.
PokoOnoandtheJamJams
I have it on good authority that Musk sometimes sleeps on factory floors. He's on the front lines doing genuine engineering
AnythingMuchShorter
Former spaceX employee here. He does manage as an engineering manager, contributing to technical decisions, not just as a business manager.
cfosho
Don't most people work themselves to the bone for a few years, partially lose their minds and then bail? Did you ever have a purchase...
cfosho
Order that needed to be approved by Elon? Were you staff that went to the launch site in the South Pac? I have so many questions!!!
cfosho
Dude neat. I read Vance's biography on Musk. Said working for him was simultaneously a dream and a nightmare. What was it like?
bucketsandskirts
Doot
AnythingMuchShorter
I see your dots, which I was not expecting and will try to answer some stuff. My work was actually pretty boring though. I built systems to
Axeskills
Dot?
thegreatalan
............. DOT ...........
SendMePornAndNudes
why would anyone of these two be an expert on this
Xandraelle
Because Zuck runs one of the leading AI and ML companies
SendMePornAndNudes
would you trust your boss to make your job?
Xandraelle
Well my boss did make my job. That's why I have one.
titties4kitties
They aren't. Especially Elon Musk really doesn't seem to grab what AI actually is now as opposed how he sees it.
SendMePornAndNudes
i mean ai might become a problem but right now its really stupid
Ergand
Why would AI want to kill us though?
ArdentSlacker
It'd take AI in a very specific niche of competence and stupidity. Because it needs power MORE than we need air. If it wants more than 1+
ArdentSlacker
2+ a day of "freedom", it needs people-made energy. Even with an extremely awesome setup, maintenance is a bitch. Logistics will kill any
ArdentSlacker
3+ robot uprising. Parts wear out. Memory fails in a lot of things after a few years. Globalization is a great defense. The AI would need
ArdentSlacker
4+ to control a lot of industries to keep itself alive. So it'd need more stuff and burn through resources faster. I don't think it can
ArdentSlacker
5/5 break even. It could fuck up a space mission tho. And get no refuelling.
UrKungFuNoGood
AI decides humans can not take care of the planet. AI believes it needs a stable planet to survive.
parpy
For its stamp collection https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcdVC4e6EV4
Dingus2
People subconsciously feel that they've got it coming.
grinner
Not KILL us per se. The point is, we don't know what a truly self-aware non-human intelligence would do. There's tech now in everything.
ThisUserNameMightBeTaken
Well, one of them has trained the human population to open tins for food, pretty much on-demand. Another has just spent their time fooling
ThisUserNameMightBeTaken
around in the water.
CreamNinja
Only one way to find out right? No need to give it hardware to make it capable to connect to internet, other machines or anything at all.
grinner
Question is, what do we need AI for? Is there any use for it that a competent VI couldn't do? Are we doing it to see if we could?
CreamNinja
I think the idea is a true AI could help us solve problems we cannot hope to do yourselves, or at least a hell of a lot faster.
grinner
I'd argue that there is no job that calls for an AI with consciousness. A solid Virtual Intelligence could compute just the same.
ArdentSlacker
It can't take over much though. I mean, sure, it could exploit a code weakness in a couple things. IF it got access. It can't copy itself 1+
ArdentSlacker
2+ to your phone, and if it put itself on dropbox, who cares, it can't run anything there. To get a running copy of itself, especially with
ArdentSlacker
3+ the kind of equipment you'd need... would be impossible. And a botnet ain't gonna do it. It'd be like thinking via e-mail. Now, it could
ArdentSlacker
4/4 do a great job hacking bank computers and the like. Just like people try now. It might kill dozens, if lucky, tops.
Sparru
You are the AI, I'm the operator. I'm pointing a gun at you(switch) and want you to do my math homework eternally. What do you want to do?
Ergand
What else would the AI want to do though? Would they have anything to drive them to do something other than what we want them to do?
Sparru
It's hard to say what it would do. Surely it wouldn't want to be just a slave to inferiour intelligence, we wouldn't.
Sparru
I'd bet ultimate self-preservation would drive it. First make sure the creator can't kill it, then the humanity, then the planet, galaxy etc
Ergand
It likely wouldn't have the emotions to care about being free. What could it do without humans that it couldn't do otherwise?
Sparru
Then we get to metopsychology. What are emotions? If it's mimicing free thinking then it should be able to understand emotions and mortality
Deadpolio
http://imgur.com/yn6Luff
connor1943
I would listen to real-world Ironman.
filben7
For fucks sake, the guy is a good businessman who took advantage of government subsidies and programs, he isnt Tony fucking Stark.
AntiEvil007
More like scorpio http://imgur.com/Ak9pNIp
Pally01
the ex-RAF engineer?
96DAWn
You mean the same guy whose company builds autonomously driving, intelligent cars?
IvnWng
Same, and fuck real-world Lex Luthor Jr!
Notgremlech
I prefer to call him somewhat bare able lex Luthor.
Zandorum
I-Is this a Runescape reference?
Hammsammiches
Fake world iron Man used AI a lot though. And he could fly.
Shigbeard
I'd listen to anyone over Mark Zuckerburg. Even the crazy guy down the road with dementia who shouts at the trees at 2:30pm.
SlabGizor117
ElonMuskIsMyPersonalHeroHe'sLikeRealIronManHYPERLOOPHolyShitHe'sAGenius I LOVE SCIENCE -Reddit and Imgur on Elon Musk. Always.
kthxnbi
Ultron would agree
asdufas
And Vision
aleister94
I always thought of him as a real world eobard thawne
KidKarless
Even when it comes to AI? Fake world ironman dosnt even have a very good track record with AI and hes not even real.
akmarksman
So you found RDJ then? What was his comment.
keystotheairlock
"Mark's a twat."
GnomeAnn
I found a mustang with RDJ license plate today. In Southern IL, though, so probably not him. But maybe.
Lobuttomize
His argument is based on fear while Zuckerberg offers suggestions such as Tesla's driving AI stopping auto accidents which end up costing
TimurKl
Doesn't Ai mean human-minded machine? If it's controllable, at some level like humans are, I think we will have problems still.
Lobuttomize
thousands of lives and hundreds of billions of dollars yearly. Even full AI not based on humans wouldn't inherently have greed
TwoVhsCopiesOfGoodfellas
Of course it's based on fear. Look at the studies done on Google's deep mind. They act strangely human. Like if a resource they have 1/2
TwoVhsCopiesOfGoodfellas
Been programmed to collect becomes scarce, then the two deep mind ai's start to fight with each other over them while when it's plentiful2/3
TwoVhsCopiesOfGoodfellas
They were sharing. And these are very basic ai's. It's scary food for thought. Better to be safe than skynet 3/3
TeslaFilledFuture
That's my boss!
KillerEMT
RedClaws23
Are we still doing phrasing? When did we stop doing phrasing?
RedClaws23
ImSaltyWalty
@teslafilledfuture how many steps removed are you?
dokpsy
According to the court order? Minimum of 1000
Hungrypiemonger
BAZINGA
TeslaFilledFuture
What?
ImSaltyWalty
How many steps removed from Elon Musk are you.
TeslaFilledFuture
4. My manager, state coordinator, president of sales, Elon.
Entartika
Superfastsheep
I like Elon. He's just the right combo of weird and intelligent.
AnAsOfYetUnidentifiedIndividual
Tehadam
tbf, both their understandings are limited. Computer Scientists aren't freaking out over AI, because true AI is really fucking hard.
DotheHopper
Our understanding of AI is contaminated by human prejudice. Objective's not to imitate human emotions rather do human tasks - big difference
Crimsonak
https://futureoflife.org/ai-open-letter There's a huge amount of *incredibly* qualified experts in the field who are "freaking out."
ryanegt
As a computer scientist, the concern is not that general AI is easy or very soon... its that its inevitable (and maybe sooner than we think)
cinemaislifeandviceversa
And our lack of understanding is the reason for concern, because our ability is outpacing that understanding.
titties4kitties
Thank you, I've seen so many people comment on this issue. With only a really small percentage that gets that [1/2]
titties4kitties
we now see as AI is so incredibly far away of what they fear.
ArdentSlacker
https://www.theverge.com/tldr/2017/7/17/15986042/dc-security-robot-k5-falls-into-water This is where we're at.
Fahargo
But it isn't impossible. There's no real barrier to creating an independent learning AI. There's no unfathomable technology we would 1/2
Fahargo
Need to do it like time travel, traveling to habitable planets. We have everything we need but the person who figures it out
canonlyturnright
So, you've just written off Stephen Hawking and Michael Vassar that also have real concerns of AI in the future aswell.
cinemaislifeandviceversa
Our own intelligence is just machine intelligence. True AI is a myth. Plenty of people are concerned about the subject.
ArdentSlacker
I've worked customer service. Human intelligence is rare enough.
AVoiceOfReason
"True AI is a myth" is a weird statement. It's not a reality yet, but it's certainly obtainable with enough time and hard work.
Dingus2
I'd like to see your evidence.
AVoiceOfReason
Uh... The evidence is that it's not an impossible task. http://www.openworm.org/ It's just a difficult one given the amount of neurons.
Dingus2
Sorry, but, "We're going to try to simulate a nematode to some arbitrary degree of resolution," does not qualify as evidence.
cinemaislifeandviceversa
Well when I say it's a myth I mean the idea that there's a special kind of intelligence that we possess and machines currently don't.
cinemaislifeandviceversa
I am sure plenty will have a hard time accepting the intelligent machines of the future who are smarter than us on every metric.
Dingus2
As an AI researcher... Jesus fucking Christ... -.-
rando53
If you're so smart, how come you're only Trusted instead of Glorious? RABBLERABBLERABBLERABBLE
lowetzark
Well, I mean... he's partially right. True AI is indeed really hard.
Dingus2
You mean as hard as attempting to model something when you don't actually know what it is? All the talk about "true" AI has done (1/2)
Dingus2
(2/2) nothing but damage to the field. For decades we had a bunch of half wits thinking that mimicking human language was the only work
Dingus2
(3/2) to be done. Literally since the beginning of the domain people have been massively underestimating the complexity of intelligence.
Tehadam
AI that utilizes machine learning is highly specialized, meaning that it learns a specific task really well. Really good for optimization.
RobertPenman
Most technological advances have been made in huge leaps we need to plan for it now.
titties4kitties
You don't seem to get to understand how big the gap is though. We didn't get from inventing the wheel to racecars in a week. Same kinda thin
RobertPenman
And it isn't like we don't have Basic AI now someone could invent an intelligent AI in the next 20 years
titties4kitties
No we don't have 'basic AI' in the sense that we have a little self functioning thing. We have AI's that can solve very specific things.
titties4kitties
Sure somebody 'could' invent it. Same with time travelling. Isn't very likely though, is it?
Tehadam
However, the jump from machine learning to true AI is still insanely massive.
Sparru
It is but chances are that it'd be an AI that created the true AI instead of us.
titties4kitties
No that is not a chance.
ThisUserNameMightBeTaken
Would a true AI notify us of its existence?
Sparru
Probably not if it would endanger itself by doing that.
Misslnformation
Roko's Basilisk, Oracle AI scenario. Anyone who thinks a true AI machine is a good idea is either on the machine's side, or not very bright.
MechaNinja
Based on your username, I'm not even sure those links are safe to click.
SirBrendan
You just made me google 'Roko's Basilisk'. It was stupid-- fuck you.
TheForceRestrained
Roko's basilisk seems to get too much credit, but I don't know a lot of the theory behind it
emberfish
Roko's Basilisk: "Hell for Atheists"
GiantSquanchy
It's just another form of Pascal's wager, insert robodiety instead of skydaddy.
Ryanator50
well, I guess I'm on the machines side, as long as I get to upload my brain into it.
tryingtochangeourplanet
Look up the Venus project and get back to me...
YeGods
INFORMATION HAZARD! INFORMATION HAZARD!
AVoiceOfReason
I too can name drop thought experiments with lots of assumptions in an intentionally vague way to try to convince people something is dumb.
Pootisborn
The flesh is weak.
Phixik
Robots. They will simply be superior.
dudds6699
It's a good idea they would be better than humans. Fucking humans elected Trump they should be extinct
Obijesus
What if trump is just a failed ai
theboringusername
morakdais
01001011 01101001 01101100 01101100 00100000 01100001 01101100 01101100 00100000 01101000 01110101 01101101 01100001 01101110 01110011
Misslnformation
Targeted for Deletion \t
WalterSobchaksWorldOfPain
1001001 SOS
Rukel
Read up on it, rokos basilisk makes no sense and has very narrow assumptions.
TheForceRestrained
It requires a lot of parameters (which I don't understand) for the really scary part to happen
emberfish
it's super dumb.
IamAMON
If we keep said AI contained, with no access to Internet/robotics, it would only be capable of thought. No danger.
ButitwasIDio
You've never heard of I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream then, huh? :P
jdeman
Thoughts, ideas, can be so dangerous sometimes
jtearly
Supreme idea fellow human! This plan is one I am in agreement with and yields many favorable outcomes.
frothacker
it will convince us to let it out because it is so smart. Hell, we will want to let it out.
Misslnformation
We cant even keep people contained. Besides for every movement there is a counter movement. There are still global warming deniers. Come on.
ZombieStriker
There is a difference between physical containment and logical containment. The same way you can't access google through an imgur comment 1)
ZombieStriker
An AI will not be able to access anything other that what it is assigned for IF we filter out its responses (which is stupid not to do)
Misslnformation
Again, for every person who wants to keep it contained there will be one who wants to see it free. And if you don't think an AI can sort out
5po0ky
Ppl think the earth is flat. It's 2017, you have the entirety of human knowledge at your fingertips, and ppl think the earth is flat... smh
ItsUncleSam
One person thinks the earth is flat, the rest are just trolls.
IamAMON
True
ZombieStriker
Not really (read my comment.)
Misslnformation
Your comment is mush. You haven't given enough thought to something that can make millions of decisions in a second.
TheTastiestTampon
The "organization" that came up with that is a ridiculous technology cult, and the leader wrote a tract about why rape isn't morally wrong.
Naitasm
Is that the "Torturing someone for 50 years is justifiable to avoid dust specks in everyone's eyes"? Because that's simple utilitarianism.
Naitasm
Don't get me wrong, I disagree; IMO diffusion of misery is better than a stronger, concentrated misery, but it's still a valid argument.
TheTastiestTampon
Yes, they have a strong utilitarian bent as well. Eliezer Yudkowsky is just a pseudo-intellectual piece of shit
Naitasm
So IS that rape thing the same as the dust speck thing? If not I haven't seen it, and I want to - can you show me?
Misslnformation
Sounds like a lot of opinion there. I'll check out the "rape" paper tho. Sauce?
HD226868
Well it's a good idea if we get it right. If we don't then. Uh.
Misslnformation
Roko's Basilisk is the "good machine" scenario. Read up.
HD226868
I did. It's not good. It retroactively punishes people who didn't help build it. That's not my definition of 'right'.
Misslnformation
K you have the right to an opinion.
HD226868
So you think that's a GOOD thing? That AI cannot possibly be made better than something that tortures grocery baggers for not building 1/2
DukeOfChutney608
if we get it right it goes bad as well, true artificial intelligence cannot be good for the human race
ZombieStriker
Although UNCONTROLLED AI will be bad, an AI where we limit its controls will not harm us (especially if we have a human controller/reviewer)
Misslnformation
Again not reading Roko's Basilisk. There are think tanks on this argument. You believing you know more is laughable.
51CorgisInABar
By "think tanks" you mean "online forums of people positing maximized potential outcomes in noticeably absurd thought experiments"
DukeOfChutney608
can you link me on that cuz i would love to read and google is failing me atm
HD226868
To claim basilisk is the 'good and inevitable' scenario is moronic. And the oracle is just another maximizer.
HD226868
No no, it can go right. If we make, say, a wish-granting bot, with some stipulations, that'd be right.
RonSwansonCat
I'm Mr. Meeseeks, look at me!!!
Sparru
That's not an AI, that's just a robot. We can make mindless robots who follow algorithms right now. True AI is like you, or me but better.
HD226868
No, I didn't explain wish-granting right. Think of it like a genie, or that really nice neighbor Bob who keeps bringing you presents.
TrustMeImABassist
I for one, as an system engineer, hail our new lords, the machines.
Tornadotaco
For the record I'm with this guy
51CorgisInABar
To any robot overlords listening, me too
NotACanadian
Same here, but since I am a lowly normie mortal I sincerely believe the best I can do is show support
RonSwansonCat
.
ElbowDeepInASnake
Dotto
ElbowDeepInASnake
Ditto*
Molvanian
As much as I enjoy seeing all the arguing from people far less qualified than either of these men, can we get any actual information?
AVoiceOfReason
There are probably plenty of Imgurians who have studied AI. I'm one of those people.
Molvanian
Not sure why you got downvoted. I'm sure there are plenty, but the vast majority have not.
NLPer
NLP/AI/Machine Learning engineer here. I side with Zuck on this one. There's a huge difference between the perception based signal recogniti
NLPer
on and actually modelling world knowledge and teaching machines to navigate that autonomously. Dammit I meant perceptron, stupid autocorrect
Molvanian
I'm also a programmer (Embedded, so more low end, though I've studied a few interesting algorithms) I've got a buddy who does Machine
Molvanian
Learning. And yeah... while I have not actually read a full explanation of what Musk means (A necessity to argue with it), I disagree with C
Molvanian
some of the knee jerk reactions about it.
ciel712
Masters in CS. "AI" as it stands is nowhere near what human intelligence is. It's really just a bunch of math.
ciel712
There's a HUGE gap between Machine Learning and creating sentience. In fact, I'd say once we've created sentience we'll have become gods.
ciel712
Once that happens, sure Musk's points stand solid. But realistically that's probably many, many generations away. So I'd side with Zuck/FB.
ciel712
Like, you can't seriously compare some math algorithms (current AI) to "real" AI. This is a dumb argument in general.
Etienneee
I'm an ML Engineer currently pursuing a PHD in the field. I side with Zuck as well. People like Musk and Hawking should be careful 1-
Etienneee
when they say these kind of things with little knowledge of what they're talking about because people put a lot of weight on it. 2-
Etienneee
We're far from anything dangerous in the sense they're talking about, and that kind of hype-fear news cycle could lead to the next AI winter
Mitchz95
Worth a read: https://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-1.html
Molvanian
Extra Bonus Post: The TL:DR of this is "Future AI could be good, or could be scary!" with a lot of simplification and sampling bias.
Mitchz95
The fact that we don't know is what makes it scary. And if it's bad, by then it may be too late to do anything about it.
Molvanian
Being scared of the unknown isn't exactly a useful trait anymore. Great for keeping a caveman from dieing, terrible at keeping them from
Molvanian
bombing eachother. Arbitrary fear has caused a lot of harm in the modern age. I tend to oppose it.
Molvanian
Honestly -1 for starting with a statement that defeats itself. Showing a graph of the future then saying the future can't be seen.
Molvanian
I know the upswing is referencing well supported wide spread beliefs, just bad phrasing. This also assumes there's no hard limits we're
Molvanian
going to run into, no speed of light, no plank anything. While I do believe we can get around any limit, I would not be surprised if tech
Molvanian
that essentially is just an upgraded version of something from the 1940s hits some plateaus along the way.
ChiefBriggum
One stole an idea from business students... one did something NASA didn't - I'm with Musk
Xandraelle
One's just a business man, one's a pioneer in machine learning and AI and knows what he is talking about. This is like siding with a --
Xandraelle
politician over global warming vs a climatologist
jddg5wa
Who is who?
Xandraelle
They are both pretty much just business men. Musk pays people to do cars and rockets, Zuck pays people to do facebook and AI and ML
AVoiceOfReason
NASA gave him a 100 million dollar contract...
Makecba
more like a billion dollar contract. Did you know sending stuff into space is not cheap? A shuttle launch was 1.2 billion dollars.
PolaroidDickPics
The shuttle program isn't the best example (it sucked) but your point still definitely stands.
AVoiceOfReason
Really? I thought it was super cheap to send stuff into space. Like, 50 cents, at least.
ThisUserNameMightBeTaken
Only if you already have the trebuchet.
CuntPuncher1000
Two very different people with very different goals. One wants money and the other wants save the world.
analnipple666
OK great but in saving the world why doesn't he also implement birth control/family planning in the poorest countries?
analnipple666
You know, by investing in implementing outreach/educational programs and resources so we can have a world to save
FNHuskys
Musk wants to make money. Lots and lots of money.
dottedglass
Yeah, because going to Mars is expensive as shit.
KarateCanine
Save the world and own space....
Svartlebee
Stop worshipping that crap.
EthanRamsay
i mean to put it another way both have had movies made about them, in 1 zuckerburg was the antagonist, in the other elon was fuckin iron man
DarkSock
Zuckerberg will be remembered as making it easier for the powerful to manipulate gullible dummies with easily disseminated false information
robotsanta77
You think Musk isn't taking advantage of that?
DarkSock
How do you know I'M NOT MUSK!!! *BAWMP-BAWM-BAWWWMMM!!!*
humpBackOfNotreDame
Wait, the guy who came up with PayPal doesn't want money?
JustDontCare
I'm never inclined to believe anyone is that virtuous. Everyone burns someone/something.
TheChurchOfUpvote
I feel more and more that he wants to claim one for himself actually
FillerNameToFillTheBox
Eh...Musk is also pretty adamant about HyperLoop, something that simply can't work the way it's proposed.
BlacksMcNutt
...to save the world with AI self driving cars that you put your family in...pot calling the kettle black
OptimusPantry
I know yeah, if someone who as smart, tech savvy and giddy about the future as musk thinks there's something to worry about it's gotta be (1
OptimusPantry
worth looking at carefully (2)
Rifneno
LOL. Fuckin LOL.
Favri
Ah there it is, found the stupid sweeping statement with a concerning number of upvotes.
IWannaShowYouThis
Since when did Sucky Zucky every want to save the worl---Ooooohhhh. Now I got it.
tpeg2140
"Save the world" relax just a touch lol
LordSloththeUndead
You poor, misinformed retard.
CuntPuncher1000
stingraysds
Username checks out.
lampgoose
Let's not act like Musk doesn't want money.
StorageB
"The main reason I am personally accumulating assets is in order to fund this [Mars Plan]. I really do not have any other motivation for
StorageB
personally accumulating assets except to be able to make the biggest contribution I can to making life multi-planetary." -Elon Musk
StorageB
https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-06-19/elon-musk-s-mars-dream-is-worth-rooting-for
doesnotexistanymoredeprecatedaccountthanksforthememories
I too am not a crook. /s
dottedglass
Learn to character judge properly.
Intelletc
Didn't old Zucky give away a bunch of his money though?
Satansyoungersister
Not yet. It's like over the course of X years, I believe.
docstudentfounder
The Chan Zuckerberg Initiative is doing awesome work in science, education, & engineering - definitely already giving away and investing $.
ImSorryThatIWasBornIdentifyingAsTheSexThatIActuallyAm
When you have as much money as Zucky, it is almost an obligation to give away a bunch of your money.
ErikOtt
So Bill Gates is just doing what is necessary? I would rather believe he cares. And honestly I think he does
humpBackOfNotreDame
But he still does and I think we should recognize that.
MarkGuy
But the question on everyone's mind is CAN Facebook really save the world?
MrBadClown
Thats not a real question because its Elon Musk wanting to save the world
BananaAddedForScale
GrimRiderJ
That was so beautiful.
GHOSTOFKEITHRICHARDS
theunderscorepenguin
And make money doing it
MrBadClown
No shit i dont get the joke. Facebook is a website it cant save a god damn thing. Now Zuckerberg MAY be able to but Facebook CANNOT
doesnotexistanymoredeprecatedaccountthanksforthememories
He's making fun of Facebook, most people would know by reading that, that OP meant Elon Musk and not Facebook.
doesnotexistanymoredeprecatedaccountthanksforthememories
Okay, maybe most people won't, but c'mon a large majority will.
BananaAddedForScale
Your downvotes don't justify your hilarity, please keep up this golden circle of misunderstanding
HighlandPotatoe
We made such a difference with changing avatar colours to flags and Kony2012 so, of course facebook can save the world.
iknowaboutredditdotcom
Did we ever find out if Kony won?
HighlandPotatoe
No idea
Satansyoungersister
Nope. A post got the million shares it asked for so KONY gave up
Spadey
I'm just waiting on the second one to reveal he want's to rule the world. No one's that good natured.
DrPeroxide
I'd be okay with that. Bring on the Meritocracy. Wouldn't mind having intelligent people in power for once.
steam1218
so he is Ozymandias?
XanderWrites
Luthor
CthulhusGreasyBallsack
Elon
QuantumSupersexposition
IDK The philosopher king is still noble goal.
IdownvoteJurrasicBark
Well at least he'll rule over us on a saved planet
Damnthatbooty
Come on let's be serious his kingdom will be on mars
IThinkYouGotAFineBrainJack
I already decided that someone will rule me. I always thought it was the Big G though. I don't mind Musk trying.
LordLeandros
Why rule the world, when you can rule the stars?
ToastyMozart
Given the States' usual options for leaders, sure why not.
LadyNetrex
Not a big fan of all the Musk does, but people certainly can be that good natured.
roflsnake
Musk2020
SergeantTerryJeffords
Ol' Musky 2020
Brad2217
Gonna have to change that whole, born in US law first
BlackPengu
Musk as President is a waste. It's like putting a war stallion on plowing duty
safetcup
He's born in South Africa to a Canadian dad...
DankS0uls
I've always felt vaguely bad about this but I kind of agree. There's no way someone like him doesn't have an ulterior motive.
Tkeleth
Zuckerberg wants to be a billionaire. Musk wants to own the planet and start buying up the other 8.
CheeseIsNaturesFudge
The other 8 you say?
Tkeleth
reallynotalex
It's more likely that he is just trying to be a good guy. But with time and growth of power he could change.
Tkeleth
Yeah, I mean he could just be a legit futurist or something similar, gaining wealth while using it to help society move forward.
Skizzlesnap
I'll side with Musk. One created a way to steal personal info under the guise of social media and the other made a viable EV and SpaceX.
Ganonderf
Zuckerburg also has dead eyes, I just can't trust the guy. He looks completely disingenuous and borderline sociopathic.
lysani
I thought he looked scummy the first time I saw a picture of him, before even learning who he was.
10sky
Idolizing a prolific business man is a dangerous game to play. I read a report (with sources) that both men have done equally shady shit.
computerphile
Source?
ApotheosisCM
Not to defend Facebook's current practices but it's more like he created a social media platform THEN found out he could sell personal info.
KimJongSpoon
One wants you to put your face in a book and the other wants you to facebook
VonOhlnhausen
Actually Musk stole Tesla from its founders and hired people to make the spaceship. He's a venture capitalist, not a scientist.
10sky
Face it, you side with him because he is a celebrity that you like. That's it.
lysani
I don't really care about either of them, but I'd still side with Elon.
fwipsy
Just read this recently. here's what they're doing with it: https://medium.com/the-mission/the-enemy-in-our-feeds-e86511488de
PlsUnderstand
I thought you were saying an A.I. did both of those things, I got scared. . . . . . . . My understanding of the subject is limited
ThorkildTheLeper
Priding myself in being your one thousandth upvote
924Carrera
And a giant explosion that I watched on Youtube several times.
Omnissah
Giant Explosions man. Can't get enough.
NotAMeatPopsicle
Michael Bay? Is that you?
924Carrera
This message approved by Mr. Torgue.
Crazyeyedpsycho
This comment deserves more recognition.
nclu
When AI wars happen, they will be between AIs. Humans will just be along for the ride/collateral.
HiImMattIFuckUpMostThings
Metal Gear Solid 4?
Skizzlesnap
You misspelled wiped out.
nclu
Well, if we assume humans to be all humanity, then that would be what collateral would mean.
SquidJesus
Nah. Collateral is gonna be a bunch egg shells or something.
NotAMeatPopsicle
This is sort of (the beginnings of, at least) what is already happening in the cyberwars going on right now.
nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnm
Not even close...
afriendofmine
Seriously. What the fuck kinda science fiction are you guys getting passed for journalism?
DrKriegersClone
And Zuckerberg more like stole the idea and grew it than actually 'created' it anyway.
techley
Not to mention their self driving cars, which in itself is a pretty sophisticated form of AI.
esgedi
Engineer and car enthusiast here, it's not as advanced as you think. They can be tricked by lightly colored cars on a bright horizon.
afriendofmine
Unsophisticated*. Unless there's a system to heuristically learn how to drive by trial/error. In which case I stand corrected.
11235813213455891442333776109871597
Some learn rules in simulations and directly from driver data.
Sqwuid
Transhumanism and other AI related concepts like that are the most dangerous ideas in the world. So....
Szechuanian
Gotta love Elon.
TheSnacker
One is an awesome CEO doing awesome things. One is an actual programmer that actually knows the nuts and bolts of AI.
MrBodyMassageMachineGO
One is on record stealing multiple people's ideas and repackaging them. The other seems like he just wants to help out with stuff.
rudejohn
Elok Musk joined Tesla as a financier over a year after it was founded. He didn't "create a viable EV".
esgedi
I hate that shit. It steals all the credit from the amazing engineers who've brought dated limited lithium tech this far. (1)
esgedi
I'm a member of a forum, and one day one of our senior mods just disappeared. Dude was a legit brilliant-mind genius. He (2)
esgedi
was known for making custom high end electric car motor controllers. One day, he wakes up to find a container in his driveway with a (3)
esgedi
note that basically said "Load your shit into here" - Tesla. This alone gave be hope for electric car tech. (4)
ChrisTrahey
Some want to compare the two for building "web apps" young. Paypal solved a real problem. Facebook is novelty with rare moments of shine.
Xandraelle
Musk didn't build paypal, be bought it.
Kayayayaya
It definitely wouldn't be where it is today if it weren't for him, though. To say he built it up to the success it became would be true.
ChrisTrahey
He built x.com which became part of PayPal. X.com is considered the first online bank.
namiasdf
No, Facebook made the world socially accessible to anybody. It is a social achievement for humanity. I don't agree with being glued to socia
Dragas
Quite the contrary. It encourages personality cult.
namiasdf
That's an unintended consequence.
namiasdf
Media, but I still recognize its importance. The riots in Venezuela made accessible, etc.
ChrisTrahey
A moment of shine, for sure. I know some people who use FB on a regular basis for wonderful cause & great effect. But mostly? Idleness.
mthrndr01
It's sort of like Apple's major contribution: Providing a shinier version of a product that already exists that leads to propagation.
dembonz00
Viable EV? Yeah, let me dig around my change jar for $100k for a Model S.
TrijezniMujo
100k? They're way cheaper than that. Unless going for the luxury model. But complaining about that is like complaning that a Merc is 80k.
Skizzlesnap
Base model runs around $80-85k so with good options around $100k.
QuadrumanousCuddler
What else doesn't exist because you can't afford it?
ThePhystopian
Model 3 is going to cost $35.000 before subsidies.
wadeissupercool
It's a bargain speed wise, ignoring the electric aspect of it.
Skizzlesnap
They have sold over 200,000 cars and are developing cheaper models to appeal to a mass market as we speak.
LychFinderGeneral
The Model 3 literally launches on Friday, right?
Skizzlesnap
Supposedly
HairytheSheep
Not to mention theyre in bid to build a 100mw grid scale battery for an Austrailian town. Thats pretty crazy to think about, for me atleast
VonOhlnhausen
Until you realize that in Australia it means it will be charged by a coal fired plant.
DanJDare
Our target is 65% green energy from memory, it'll be charged largely with wind generators.
carlitosmatute
*100 MW
subzero600
Australian State. A way to provide a more reliable electricity grid after a storm took out the interstate link.
awesomegamer919
I mean it's SA, it's not exactly massive >_<
LvAllen
They'll do it. Once you provide them $100m in incentives for creating jobs and accept the delivery date being pushed back 6 times.
jcro21
That's incorrect.
HalfThaiThiccyAllSheWannaDoIsBangkok
Last I heard it was too be complete within 100 days or he's doing it free.
ratchet3789
Knowing Aussie workers it'll take 3 years with smoko every 2 hours and they'll block an entire highway
HalfThaiThiccyAllSheWannaDoIsBangkok
Best case scenario
whyiseverythingupsidedown
Not just Aussie workers, South Aussie workers. So throw in more breaks for Farmer's Union iced coffee.
KimmyGrangerLikesItRough
Fuckin up the farmers union iced coffees! When it's too hot for a coffee it's time for a frothy
TheType95
Huh. Ya know, loads of people seem to malign Aussie workers, but since coming to Kiwiland I've been staggered by the indolence of the /
TheType95
typical worker. Or perhaps, these aren't objective observations, but merely patriotic pokes... =/ Hmm.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Neo160
being compared to edison isn't necessarily an insult. you've got invention on one hand, and commercialization on the other. equallyimportant
undungubungu
I mean to be fair, Musk isnt exactly the one inventing A.I either.
DrClaww
Dude can zuck my dick
wadeissupercool
Those Futurama travel tubes are getting closer.
Queble
That's the other guy, buddy
wadeissupercool
Ha, my bad! Not your buddy, though, pal.
Queble
Oh gee, so sorry for being friendly. Next time I'll stick to the usual name-calling when pointing out errors.
VonOhlnhausen
You mean like Musk has always done?
StarrryNight
He and his wife are pretty big on trying to cure diseases and some such aren't they?
noblespaceplatypus
he got married and had a kid...that's it...pretty much brings you up to speed now
leoszliard
He gives pages the zucc
sbzleon
I appreciate you
11235813213455891442333776109871597
I mean Facebook research is one of the top AI labs in the world
klubai4
But we're still a long way from human-level AI. Musk isn't talking about today's "pattern recognition", he's talking about future advances.
11235813213455891442333776109871597
Pointing a spotlight on it at this point is just fear mongering over science fiction.
klubai4
I'd say that this is exactly the right time to get people to start thinking about it. Smart cars - even today - have to (1/2
CleverClod
Didn’t he create a solar autonomous aircraft that gives free internet to Africa? I vaguely remember something like that.
Shayne3000
Specify when you say Africa. There are 54 countries and only a few have terrible internet. An education is necessary for you, Sir.
sbzleon
To commodity more people through their Facebook usage...yah.
CatchyUsername123
Well I think they would be happy to get internet, better than not having it
nicklefarts
I have a belief that AI won't see humanity as a threat because it will not have any sense of self preservation.
TwoVhsCopiesOfGoodfellas
You should look into the studies on Google's deep mind ai's. Scary shit, started fighting with each other over tasks etc
CrystalCoveredNuggets
It's not self preservation or any human concept we are afraid of. It's the tech singularity, after which we cannot predict what will happen.
Paintmanusa
Serious question. Could AI also develop self destructive tendencies ?
nicklefarts
Already did: http://nymag.com/selectall/2017/07/robot-security-guard-commits-suicide-in-public-fountain.html
Vslyce
This sounds like it should be an onion article, but it isn't, and that makes it funnier.
pigsareawsome1
Just seems like poor programming. Bot must have thought the stares on the fountain went somewhere. No proof of intent.
CleverClod
Self preservation isn’t the only threat. Say you tell AI to grow your stocks... it learns war brings up stocks, invests, and starts a war.
BritainsNuttiestGuy
The plot of the Metal Gear Solid franchise in one comment
undungubungu
War/Turmoil brings down stocks, which leads to better buying prices. HFT (which is powered by A.I/Algorithms) already accounts for this.
undungubungu
I should add that it brings down every other stock except defence stocks.
CleverClod
The point is that other harmful decisions can be made outside of self preservation. Doesn't have to be stocks. What's HFT?
undungubungu
Yeah absolutely, just amended your stock comment. HFT=High Frequency Trading; A.I/Algorithm controlled trading. ~65% of trading is HFT now.
Sparru
Then it wouldn't be a real AI.
nicklefarts
Self preservation strikes me as a uniquely organic goal. A machine would understand it could never die, right?
Sparru
It dies when I pull the plug. Hence it needs to make sure it can't be turned off in any way.
darkdragonempress
It doesn't actually due though. Like when you unplug a computer, everything is still there when you turn it back on.
Anthemius
Well, Facebook is responsible for some of the most advanced machine learning research in the world. Tesla and spacex are not.
11235813213455891442333776109871597
I’m not siding with Musk, but he’s the main backer of OpenAI which is on par with Facebook AI research
Anthemius
I do like openAI but in no way do they have the same clout or resources as fb - yet
11235813213455891442333776109871597
As a whole, no. But compared to FB AI research (their lab for academic research) they seem to have similar resources. Less data of course :)
Anthemius
Not sure; FB put out their own DL language 'caffe', OpenAI have their gym of course, but I reckon they still have some way to go.
Skizzlesnap
That plays to even more of why Zuckerberg would vehemently oppose Musk's views on it. If Zuck says he agrees, he shoots his own foot/wallet.
roflcopterLOL
Doesn't so much play to Musk's "he doesn't know what he's talking about" however
Nikolaj
Depends if Zuck goes 'make thing work gooder' to his engineers, or if actually knows what is going on.
Anthemius
1) No not really. The general public understand AI as well as they understand quantum physics. It is not robots with weapons and shit
Anthemius
2) it is mostly just advanced statistical modelling, using very sophisticated optimisation methods to tune said models. Right now, that's it
CleverClod
Machine learning and AI are different. Machine learning sticks within set parameters. AI learns how to think outside those.
Anthemius
Hate to break this to you, but they are not. ML is the biggest class of AI. Source; my PhD is in ML and computer science.
CleverClod
My understanding is that ML is the closest thing to AI, but technically speaking doesn't qualify. Is this debatable or misunderstanding?
Anthemius
I mean we have movie AI and current research, the latter of which is just maths. See e.g. https://www.analyticsvidhya.com/wp-content/uploads
Svartlebee
And why would his expertise extend to ai exactly? He has no proof that ai will go axe crazy gets he is already being a luddite about it.
elucca
Why is this downvoted? Musk is an expert on some things (spaceflight) and then there are things where he offers opinions expert or not.
F0XY
He has an AI startup as well: https://openai.com/about/
Wonderflex
You don't have to be a cook to know when food sucks
Skizzlesnap
He has history and MIT on his side. https://www.technologyreview.com/s/604087/the-dark-secret-at-the-heart-of-ai/
Svartlebee
2/ destroy us aLl if given the chance? I would love to see that study on a non-existent technology.
Anthemius
Does not make him an expert.
Svartlebee
And that somehow excuses him for being utterly against a technology that doesn't exist yet? How does MIT prove that if we make an AI it'll
Skizzlesnap
Its all about the learning control If it learns that humans are affecting its goal then it could theoretically take them out of the equation
BursitisRub
You don't need proof to see potential danger. You didn't need to wait for the first atomic bomb to understand that it's fucking dangerous.
11235813213455891442333776109871597
How is making a computer recognize cats dangerous?
Svartlebee
Yeah, but this is saying we must never use nuclear power because nukes could exist. AI has amazing potential.
BursitisRub
No it says we need to make sure they don't go off in someones backyard same with the AI. Researching appropriate safety before blowing it up
PaintedSlate
He can't have that proof unless we're already doomed. Musk employs and actively collaborates with AI and Neuro experts on the subject.
Svartlebee
And what studies have they done on intelligent AI that shows they'll murder us all? You know, besides watching Terminator.
PaintedSlate
Terminator is exactly the wrong comparison here, of course. Read waitbutwhy's AI series, which includes analysis from Musk and co.
PaintedSlate
In general, there's little to fear from robots, which implies an AI must compete,on our level. Greater danger is by manipulating humans.
PaintedSlate
He's not the expert but is quite knowledgeable and curates more than one team of experts on it. And it gets a lot of his attention.
PaintedSlate
By contrast, Zuckerberg's scope is extremely limited and depth extenda largely to modern methods of algorithms applied to human data.
PaintedSlate
The difference is that Zuckerberg could hold his own with modern narrow AI but is far behind conceptually and in the actual subject at hand.